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Tuning the Frequency: How Mindset Powers Agent Success with Toby Brazwell
Tuning the Frequency: How Mindset Powers Agent Success with Toby Brazwell
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About this episode
Toby Brazwell joins The Accelerator to discuss the power of mindset and emotional intelligence in achieving success as an insurance agent. He shares insights from his diverse background as a musician, author, and community leader, emphasizing the importance of tuning into people's frequencies to improve communication and connection. The conversation explores reframing failure as a learning opportunity, the significance of building a personal board of advisors, and treating every interaction like an interview. Brazwell's unique perspective encourages listeners to embrace discomfort as a catalyst for growth and to foster collaboration for greater impact.
Topics:
mindset
emotional intelligence
failure reframing
personal board of advisors
tuning frequencies
sales strategies
community impact
leadership
vulnerability
interview techniques
Cars:
Honda Accord
Today, we welcome a true multi-hyphenate guest – Toby Brazwell, who is a district leader, musician, author, and empowerment coach. Toby joins the show to explore how emotional intelligence and mindset shape performance, why building your “personal board of advisors” is a game-changer for insurance professionals, and dig into the powerful idea that every interaction is an interview.
Here’s what we’ll cover in this episode:
(00:57) Introducing Toby Brazwell: mindset, music, leadership and impact
(05:16) Connecting creativity, music and business
(11:13) Emotional intelligence and tuning into frequencies
(14:12) Coaching mindset and cultivating EQ in sales teams
(18:14) Reframing failure – you either win or learn
(20:00) Learning from adversity: Everest and Tom Brady
(22:24) Unlocking potential and building your Friendship Incorporated
(27:05) Writing ‘The Empowerment Chords’ and finding your power
(30:14) Are top insurance agents born or trained?
(34:02) The power of systems in sales performance
(35:38) Coaching underperformers – stick, carrot or conversation?
(41:32) Habit shifts: treat every interaction like an interview
(45:30) From insurance to city council: purpose-driven leadership
(50:10) Top takeaways and final thoughts
Links mentioned in this episode:
Connect with Toby Brazwell on LinkedIn
The Empowerment Chords – Book
The E-Myth Revisted – Book
Fortune article on Tom Brady
Send your questions and feedback to Bryant and John at [email protected]
Filter:
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Technical
Too Afraid to Ask
Car
Honda Accords
"...tarting line, that's really the pure empowerment accords that he talked about. That's right. And with tha..."
The Honda Accord is a type of car that is roomy and comfortable, making it great for families or people who drive a lot. It's known for being dependable and not breaking down often, which is why many people choose it. It's been around for a long time, so lots of drivers trust it.
The Honda Accord is a midsize sedan known for its reliability, spacious interior, and strong performance. It has been a popular choice among families and commuters since its introduction in 1976, often praised for its balance of comfort and efficiency. The Accord's significance lies in its consistent ranking as one of the best-selling cars in the United States.
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Welcome to The Accelerator, a podcast for insurance agents and brokers who know there's
more to life than bundling home and auto.
Yeah, we're talking collector cars, better sales strategies, and ideas to grow your business
without boring you to death.
This isn't just another industry podcast.
It's the one you're actually going to want to listen to.
Welcome back to The Accelerator, a podcast by Hagerty for insurance agents and brokers
who want to stay ahead of what's next in our industry.
I'm your host, John Gessner.
And I'm also your host, Brian Colley.
Today's guest, one of my favorite people to talk to because he does not believe in standing
still and neither do I.
He's a district sales leader, a musician, an author, a podcaster, a community leader,
and somehow he blends all of that into making sense.
Yeah, now today we're going to be talking about mindset, emotional intelligence,
and leadership with someone who lives it every day, Toby Broswell.
And don't worry, we're going to make it related to insurance somehow.
But if you don't know Toby yet, here's the quick version.
Like I said, author, motivational speaker, entrepreneur,
all of that work blends to insight, creativity, and community impact.
As a district leader with farmers insurance, he's helped countless agents and business owners grow
in ways that are rooted in purpose, strategy, and integrity, not just production.
Yeah, and outside of insurance, we've touched on all the things that Toby does.
He co-hosts the Music and Meeting podcast, Riffs on Riffs, and he wrote the book,
The Empowerment Chords, which helps people find rhythm, resilience, and purpose in both life and
work. He even ran a spirited campaign for the Novi City Council, and he continues to pour into
his community through volunteering, mentorship, and helping young voters find their voice.
So in other words, the mission is pretty simple that he lives by.
Help people recognize their potential and the power of collaboration.
And today, we're going to put that mission right into your world as an insurance professional.
That's right. In this conversation, we get into really three big things.
One, how being a musician and entrepreneur taught Toby to tune into people's frequencies
and connect with all kinds of personalities. Two, why mindset and emotional intelligence
are often the true separators between average and top performing agents.
And lastly, number three, what it looks like to reframe failure so you either win or you learn.
And how that plays out in sales, leadership, and even running for office.
We're going to talk about this concept he's introduced to me in the past called friendship
incorporated. It's kind of like Monster's Inc., but just for friends. But honestly,
though, building a personal board of advisors remind you of your superpowers,
powerful habits from his book, treating every interaction like an interview.
And if you lead people, coach producers, or just want to show up differently for your clients,
this one is packed with ideas. All right, Brian, let's do it. Let's just jump right in.
And here's our conversation with author, leader, and empowerment coach, Toby Brouswell.
Welcome, everyone. I'm really, really excited to welcome a guest today that I've worked with
for a long time. And he has such amazing talent. He has done so many different things. This
conversation today is going to be incredibly exciting. We're going to weave it all together
into leadership, running for office, insurance sales, coaching, like it's going to all come
together, everyone. So we're in for a treat today. My good friend, Toby Brouswell, from
downstate Michigan. Toby, welcome to the podcast.
Come on, man. Thank you so much for having me. I really appreciate it. Look forward to the
conversation. I know all the times we've talked before together, it's been always great conversation.
And I have a feeling, I have a good feeling this is going to be one of those conversations as well.
It's going to be a good one. So thanks so much for having me.
Yeah, absolutely. So Toby, for the listeners that may not know you yet,
describe what you do and what drives your work today.
Well, you know, if I had my wife on here, she would tell you that I can't sit still. So,
you know, my mentality in life is kind of like a sports game. You want to leave it all there on
the field. And Brian, I think you and I are gentlemen of a certain age, right? And I think
what you get around after 40 in this area code of after 40, it's not about doing something just
to do it. You really want to do something to make it impact. And it's all about legacy.
So to me, that's what empowers me to continue on doing things, taking chances,
taking risks, be really, really strategic and change hearts and change minds through action.
I believe that, you know, love is good work in action. And I just want to do that.
I want to show love and everything I do. So whether it's motivational speaking,
whether it's being a district manager here for the company that I've been with for 20 years,
farmers insurance, whether it is writing my book or being more involved with the city,
it's important. It's important to do everything with love. So that's the energy that kind of
you've got sales, you've got leadership, you've got politics. Tell us a little bit about how all
that creativity and business has shaped you as a coach and a leader. And how did you put all that
stuff together? Talk about like all that different. I mean, usually leadership and music don't go
together. Usually, you know, politics and sales don't go together necessarily. Talk a little
bit about that to us. Yeah, you know, I think it all starts from things all kind of got to start
from music. You know, my both my parents are well educated. My dad was an engineer, mom's a chemist,
both switch careers and to go into education. They both have their PhDs in education.
Well, amazing sight to see both your parents walk across the stage to get their PhDs together,
right? And not be fighting. That's amazing. So but in my pursuit, I knew I didn't want to do
anything like that. I didn't want to get a degree in business. I got my degree just to get a degree,
my degrees in criminology of all things. I could have picked from a bunch of different majors,
but criminology, I thought was just so interesting to me because, you know, I'd always was raised
essentially by society and everything else, like to think one way about these people. Hey,
you do crime, you're absolutely wrong. That's it. There's no if ands, buts about it. Criminology is
just the, you know, sociology of crime. And it's like, Oh, man, this is crazy. You learn about
the factors that led to these decisions. All right. And I'm also a musician. I had a band in
college always looking for things to write about. I sing and also I'm an MC as well. I love words
and just kind of putting all of that together. Really. I just really wanted to be a musician.
That was like, that's like my love and my passion. Really, really, really wanted to be a musician.
But I needed something. I needed a job to kind of fund that habit. We need something.
And it was really, really tough decisions for me. But just like with good citizens that go to
crime, this is a series of events that happen. It's like, look, I can't just do music that we got
it. We're going to have to change the path a little bit. The interesting thing about being a
musician is it forces you to be an entrepreneur. We're literally selling CDs out the backs of
our cars. That's what we do. We had to find gigs. We will call up places and say, Hey,
I know that you've got so and so performing on this day. Do you have an opener? If you don't,
we will open for you for free. Really? Yeah, we'll do it for free. We're in Cleveland.
We know you're in Pittsburgh. We're rolling. We'll be there. Great. Do it. Do it. And then
find ways to make many tours and things like that. And then politics for people. So if you
meet musicians, right, let me tell you, the weirdest people on the planet is musicians.
But they all have very unique frequencies. And just like with a radio, if you talk to them
long enough, and if you're listening, you can tune into that frequency and find similar wavelengths
that connect us all. Just building these relationships. And I didn't think about it,
but it was a business. I didn't think about it, but I was being an entrepreneur. And then when
insurance came along, they were like, well, Toby, aren't you nervous talking to these customers
about XYZ? Am I nervous talking to this person knocking on doors of what not to talk to this
person about my insurance products when I have freestyle in front of hundreds of people? No,
I'm not. There's no comparison, man. There's just no comparison. I'm fearless when it comes to those
things. I mean, I still get nervous from time to time, but I still I'm able to channel that energy
into something else. So, you know, and I guess throughout, and that's always just fueled me,
you know, I realized, okay, music is going to go is that dream is that dream will never be what I
really wanted to be initially. But can I use those same skills to build a career in business?
Yes, I can. And now I'm using it to not only fuel my business as a district manager, but also
I found that I have this other loves of motivating people in other businesses,
in other business markets or whatnot. And that's that is what it's all about. I love that. So,
I'm just trying to I'm doing both and trying to find I will say balance because I think balance is
kind of like both sides fighting each other and trying to find that harmony where, you know,
you're not my musician, Brian. So, what do you want from me? What do you want from me, Brian? Of
course, I want weird man. I want the weird man. Bring the weird Toby. And I can relate to this
a little bit. So, I have recently started doing improv comedy growing up. I always love to make
people laugh, but I never, you know, never did theater, never did acting, never did any of that
type of stuff. I was just always found an opportunity to try to, you know, brighten someone's day,
make somebody laugh. And I can just say now I do that, not as a career, although I do it with
people that are trying to make it a career, but I do it just as a creative outlet. And
I can just really resonate with theater people. I love them. They can also be a little weird,
just like they are weird. Period. Yeah. But that I think that is a I use that term out of love,
right? Weird is not negative. Weird is not in my mind. And in this context specifically, not
a negative thing, but I loved what you touched on when you said frequencies, you know, being able
to dial into different frequencies and really understand, you know, who that person is and
to be able to communicate with them, hear them clearly, right? When you dial in the frequency,
right? Where it's supposed to be. And then you can also communicate back clearly. So, I'm just,
I'm curious if you could maybe speak to that a little bit and how you, if there's a way that
you try to bring that type of messaging to your work and then to the other sales folks that you
work with, that idea of frequency and how do you use that experience to get on the same wavelength
with your customer or with, you know, a partner or prospect to really get on that same page and
effectively communicate? That's a really good question, John. First off, props to you for doing
improv. I think that is one of the bravest things that you can do. That is, that is strong. But
the skills that you develop from that in from any kind of thing that you do out of passion,
I think is this warmest soul. So, all right, so let's talk about frequencies. Well, here, here's
my whole mindset when it comes to frequency. I believe that we all have the ability to tune
in to, to the wavelength or find common wavelengths between people. Now, I told you I'm a man of a
certain age, right? So back in the day, John, this is before your time, right? TVs, we didn't have
the type of cable that we have right now. Your father, you know, if he really cared about you,
he would say, hey, stand up by the TV and I want you to raise your hands. So, yep, touch the TV,
raise the hand. You're the intent of Toby. It's important that you not move, right? The only time
you move is during commercials. That's how you know your dad loved you. Okay. My dad loved me
very much, John. Very, very much. No, I'm just kidding. But one thing I will say with those
old school TVs is that in old school radios, for that matter, is that you sometimes will have to
move the antennas to get a better frequency. This is the problem, I think, with society right now.
I feel that to have empathy, it takes energy. I am a person that I'm perfectly willing to move
to get a better frequency, to get better reception in regards to how we work with people. So, what
does that mean? Well, sometimes it means telling a joke. Sometimes it means being vulnerable, maybe
making fun of myself in order to gain traction with someone else. If you're willing to do that,
I think you can go far. It's not the end or be all, but if we're being honest, I think comedy
is a way to press control, all control reset or whatnot in regards to tough situations. Comedy
sometimes can just go right through. We have to have a tough conversation, but if I can make you
laugh, okay, all right, we're not crying anymore. We are laughing. This is different.
And these emotions are all so closely tied with each other, right? Someone breaks your heart,
they make you really upset. Hey, you're going to be crying, but you see something really beautiful
on TV, you know, our spouses watching notebook, they're crying, right? But it's the same result,
but different for different reasons. So, I just feel like if we, all that is is fine-tuning of
the frequency and it takes effort. Who's willing to put that effort in? Well, I'm not saying I'm
perfect, but I've achieved what I've achieved because I've been able to move and kind of adjust
just my frequency to match others. It's not being fake, it's just being willing to listen,
being willing to listen and having that in you. So, I hope that answers the question.
Yeah, thank you, Toby. We have to go so many places. I want to get into you. You're an author,
you're running for office, you're doing all kinds of stuff. But before I go there, what you just said
hit me because I know something you've told me multiple times and I agree with that. Like,
I'm a thousand percent aligned with what this means. You've said that mindset and emotional
intelligence often separates top performers, right? And there's other things too, but those two
things and you just said it, right? Like, maybe there's a time to crack a joke or maybe there's
a time to cry with someone. All of a sudden, you have that connection and that sets you apart
from someone else. How do you coach or cultivate those qualities in the sales teams that you
lead or maybe the professionals that you coach outside of insurance? Like, how do you talk to
people about that? Because emotional intelligence is a hard, it's like a squishy subject, right?
You can't really like, get your arms around emotional intelligence, but it's so important.
So how do you coach on that? It's a good question. One thing I will say is it definitely takes time.
You know, I'm 51. I would say that this is totally different version of 31, right? Totally
different version of 41. I didn't even like those guys. Kidding. It's a totally different,
totally different version of me. But you know, I think it's my job to make sure that the version
that you see today is the best version of me. When it comes to mindset and emotional intelligence,
I think we have an issue right now that I see we are obsessed with perfection. We are obsessed
with perfection. And I think that that's a problem, right? It's not just in business. It's in
relationships. It's in youth sports. It's in academia as well. I feel that in a game situation,
we either we win or we learn, and there's never been a better time to learn than now in the present.
We are too afraid to lose. And now what does that mean? So since we're too afraid to lose,
that does that mean that if the results are not what we want, then that means we make excuses
for that. Like, no, we didn't lose what you talked about. I didn't lose at all. You know,
the score is wrong. The rest, right? Her arguments whack. Her arguments off. What are you talking
about? The system that tells me what time I came into work. That is off. It's five minutes off.
I wasn't late. What are you talking about? You know, I'm always right. We are afraid to admit
and we are wrong. Unfortunately, that is the time where the most growth can happen. I believe that
sales happens when the customer or the prospect says, no, I think that's when sales starts. I
think growth comes when we are challenged. And if we look at any book or any movie that we really
enjoy, where's this the story of the hero, this arc, they have to go through struggles in order
to get there. So how do I use that with folks? I use this like, man, this is tough. This is,
you know, you go on to it right now. And I honestly, I don't know what's going to happen at the end
of the day. I don't know. But one thing I do know is that we're going to learn something.
We're going to learn. If we don't win, we're going to learn. And I would prefer for us to do both.
That's what I say in my campaign. I run it for city council right now. It's totally you think
you're going to win? You think you're going to win? You're a first time candidate. You put a lot
out there. You knocked on these doors. You put money into it. You did this. You did that. You
really are exposed in a lot of ways. Aren't you afraid of what losing could mean to you and what
your legacy is all like? No, I am never, I will never be afraid of learning. I will never be
afraid of learning. I will never be afraid of evolving. And evolution is a choice. And I feel
that it's a choice that's not made just once. It's a choice that's made daily. It's a choice that's
made moment by moment. And so I think mindset is the same thing. I think we have to choose to be
our best selves moment by moment. You never those choose your own adventure books, right? I think
your life is absolutely that. It's a choose your own adventure type story with every decision that
you make. I think we're incredibly capable of doing most anything, but we can't do everything.
And so you've got to pick and choose. What are you really about? What's the cornerstone of Toby?
It's the cornerstone of Brian. It's the cornerstone of John. What makes you happy? What makes you
you? Okay, let's focus on that. And sometimes while we don't get the results we want, what people
call fail, sometimes I think that's a step potentially in the direction of you becoming
what you're really supposed to be turning. Yeah, Toby, something I just have to interject really
quick because you hit it so much last week. I was at a conference and we had Allison Levine,
who's the first female lead expedition to the top of Mount Everest. Something I did not know
about Mount Everest is like base camp. You spend like a couple of weeks. And then you go up to
like base camp. By the way, there's a four base camps to get the top. We go to base camp one for
a day. And then you hike back to base camp one for like a week. It takes three months to get all
the way up to base camp four because you're slowly dying every time you leave base camp.
Like if your body is dying, right? And so something she said that you just said,
and you just said in a little bit different way is she said most of the time going to Mount
Everest you're actually hiking down. It's weird, but you're hiking down most of the time because
you hike down four or five times to go up to base camp one, right? And so she said there's a
difference between hiking down or backing up and not making progress. Just because you're backing
up or hiking down doesn't mean you're not making progress. And that's exactly what you just said.
And you're right. Like you could not have a good movie without someone going through adversity.
And like that would be a boring movie if everyone just looked and said, oh, no,
everything's going perfect. There's nothing wrong, right? So I loved that. That was really,
really inspiring. Thank you for sharing. Agree. And if I could also add just a couple things to
that Toby, because there are several things you said resonated with me. One of them is pushing
yourself through the discomfort. And there's a story I read about Muhammad Ali and okay,
granted it was online. So let's just take that with a grain of salt. But he was asked what it
came to his training, how many sit-ups or how many crunches do you do every day? And his response
to this, I don't know. I don't even start counting until it hurts. And so that is that period of
growth that discomfort is growth. If you're always sitting in comfort, you're not growing,
you're not changing, you're not evolving. It's that discomfort that drives growth. And that's
always stuck with me, especially when I'm in my basement at six in the morning, you know,
trying to get my workout on. And the other thing was just an article I read last night,
Tom Brady gave a talk at a fortune event. So this is an article I read on fortune.
And he talks about how today we have a tendency as parents and I'm a parent to two young kids to
make things easy for our kids. When they run into a wall, when they hit some difficulty,
we redirect them to something that's easier. And he talks about that as just a great disservice
to our kids, because he reflects on his own childhood and how he had to, he tried out,
you know, everyone knows the Tom Brady story, right? But when you look at him today, you just
see the success, the winningest quarterback, you know, or player in all the NFL history.
But he talks about his high school experience where he had to try out every year and he didn't
make starting quarterback till his senior year in high school. And he said today it may be that
if a kid doesn't make starting quarterback freshman or sophomore year, the parents will
transfer him to another school where there's a program where he could start right away.
But it's that it's that sitting in discomfort, it's that drive to push yourself to get better.
It's the wanting and the discomfort to get to that place and the work for it that really,
you know, empowers people and strengthens people. And so I just, I wanted to share those because
it just felt so similar to the stories that you're sharing and your perspective of working
through that discomfort and finding learning, you know, those learning opportunities to grow.
And just to kind of wrap this up, you just are oozing positivity. And you talk, I think, a lot
about not focusing on the weakness. You call it learning. And you really seem to emphasize
wanting to unlock your own potential and the potential and others. So, and you've had some
great self realization, you know, but how can you help coach people to see their own power
differently? How do you really try to land this message? Because it's easy to say, but it's hard
to do. So how do you help people get to that doing part? Okay, I'm a comic book fan. Let's start
with that. I'm a comic book. I've been reading comic books for years. So ever since I was a
conservative grade, I learned a long time ago not to follow the character, right? Not
fun. I love, you know, there's certain characters I love with this, you know, the X man or Batman
spider mix. I learned some a long time ago, my brother, he taught me this. He said, Hey, don't
follow the actual character. Follow the writer. Follow the writer instead. The writer is the
most better one. Okay, now with that being said, we have this narrative about ourselves.
And everyone does. They have these voices in their mind. And my question to you,
is the narrative telling you is the narrator telling you the entire story? Is the narrator
telling you the entire story? Are they a valid narrative? Can they be trusted? With that being
said, let me say this, you are not your thoughts. You are not your thoughts. You can have a thought
going through your head. Hey, you're a bad father. You're a bad husband. You are affordable. So you
are not a good salesman. These thoughts are both your head, but you can also have the reverse.
You're a great salesman. You're a great father. Hey, you're not your thoughts, though. It really
is the action that will show that, right? Okay, I feel that with all these voices that you might
hear, I feel you can get lost. It takes a team of trusted people around you. I treat my friendship
with others like it's a business, right? I call this concept Friendship Incorporated,
right? So I run this LLC. There are no employees. No one works for me. I have contractors.
And Brian's good at this and Joe's good at that, right? John's good at this or what have you. And
all of these people I consult with in different ways. So John's got young kids, okay, well,
I need issues. I have a question about dealing with young kids. I'm going to talk to that consultant.
Brian is an insurance business. Hey, I have an insurance question. Brian is my consultant for
that stuff. I feel that we have to identify the consultants in our lives for us to make better
and better informed decisions. And I feel too many people don't have that. And one of the problems
with that is that I'm relying, that some folks are relying on these consultants that are not
necessarily the best, you know, for that particular job, right? They do, you know, someone that doesn't
have kids, hey, God bless you, but you don't, you don't know what it means to be a parent and see
you become a parent. I mean, that's just the sack. So you need to have, you need to have those people
around you. I think those folks can kind of let you know, remind you of who you are. They can remind
you of what your superpower is. Like, John, you're Superman. You can fly. Why are you walking?
Why are you walking when you can fly? That makes no sense. What are you doing? Like,
Spider-Man, you know, you have the ability to hold onto things and stick on walls and whatnot.
That makes it, it doesn't make sense. You're not using all of your abilities to the best.
Sometimes, you know, I feel like it just takes that, you know, members of this friendship
incorporated to kind of talk you through that, you being open, really knowing what makes you happy,
really have a good sense of self, because just contractors come and go in business.
They come and go. That's why I use that analogy of contractors, because I can find another
contractor to that part for what I need to be done, right? And what I mean by that is that we
go through seasons of relationships. Is this their season or not? So I know, I hope that
doesn't seem like a fuzzy answer. I really want to, you know, I want it to be clear, but it does,
I don't think anybody can really do this by themselves. I think everyone, you know, they
say it takes a village to raise a child. I completely do that. I think it takes communities
to foster a good nation. That's one of the reasons why I'm running for city councils,
because I want my community to be as strong as it can. If we think the nation is weak,
or it has areas or opportunity to grow, I think it starts at the community level.
Love that. Thank you. And I want to circle back to politics here in a minute, but I love the
Friends Incorporated concept. And, you know, that could be the title of your next book. And
I say next book because you have actually already written and published a book called
The Empowerment Chords. And, you know, we can feel this through line of music and creativity
already just in our conversation. And chords really, really speaks to that.
Wondering how did that book come to be? What inspired you or was there a defining moment
that drove you to write that book? Or was there just a message you wanted to share?
Can you talk a little bit about that? Yeah. So the book is called The Empowerment Chords.
I would describe myself as an empowerment coach, you know, basically helping people
navigate through problems they see day in and day out. And how do I do that? I do that through
a list of lessons that I've learned in life called The Empowerment Chords. These are lessons that I
wanted to write down because I realized, even though I love the talk, even though, I mean,
I love the talk, John, you know this, right? Even though I love the talk, I found myself
repeating myself over and over and over again to the agents that I was serving. And, you know,
we would talk about one particular issue, but I would use an analogy or use these chords to
kind of help guide them through that. And I said, man, I am an insurance professional. If something
were to happen to me and I left home and wasn't able to come home that night, I wanted to leave
something for my son to have and to know this is how his father thought about issues. It's kind
of giving some guidance if I wasn't physically there. So I wrote the books for him. To me,
it serves so many different types of communities and I wanted it to be like a different type of
business book, a different type of motivational book. So that was the reason why I wrote it.
I am, it's funny that you mentioned, you know, the title of the new book, right, called Friendship
Binks. The next book is called Metaphors to Milestones. And the whole book is all of these
analogies. And Friendship Incorporated is actually one of the chapters in the book
that talks about that relationship with this group of people that's supposed to support you.
That's what the premise of the book, you know, kind of one of the subtitles theme in my life,
subtitle for the book and scene of my life in both books is if you can change your perspectives,
you can sign your powers. If you can change your perspective, you can sign your power. And I think
analogies are a great way of changing someone's perspective on a certain issue. So that's why
I think the work is important. That's why I think it's powerful. That's why I'm so excited that when
this book gets finally written, I'm about 20 chapters, 20 chapters in right now, probably like
with the goal of like 33. So when it's done, man, I'll let you guys know, I would love to get back
on here with you guys to kind of talk about that. If you'll have me, I think they can really help
people. If you like the friendship incorporated idea, you'll love the bit. Yeah, definitely, Toby.
You're welcome on any time, especially, you know, let's talk about that book when it's 100%.
Talk a little bit about your leadership in coaching philosophy. What's your coaching
philosophy that comes to sales performance? Do you think salespeople are born? Do you think
they're trained? Do you think they're coached? Do you think they're all the above? Are certain
people better at sales because they like to talk like you and I? Or is maybe listening better,
you know, let's talk about that for a little bit.
So there's a book I read a lot back and you probably familiar with and it's called
The E-Myth by Michael Berber. And so he talks about the importance of having talent is awesome,
but having systems is that much more important, right? Some companies and a lot of entrepreneurs
are getting by just on talent. They're getting by just on talent. They don't have systems really
in place. So I know I'm going to take a little bit round about way of answering this question,
right? I just want you to roll with me just a little bit, indulge me if you will. I believe
that everything is sales. I believe that everything is sales. I believe there's a movie I want to go
to and I have to convince the family that sales. What do you want to eat for dinner tonight? My
wife doesn't want to cook that particular. She doesn't want this. She don't want this. This is
sales. Hey, do you want to go out with me, right? When I'm looking to corporate, that will sales.
Everything is sales, all right? So are salesmen born or are they taught? I think that we have
some people that are just naturally more talented than sales per se, but I do think it's a skill,
a muscle that we seem to tell. And I know that that's the case because I've seen,
and I can talk about the industry because I'm in it, right? We talk about musicians are weird.
Hey, insurance professionals are weird, right? You know this. Don't try to deny it. We're weird.
We're different. Who gets up in the morning says, man, let's talk about indemnity. Like,
no one does that. That's weird, right? This is a very weird thing. But we have the ones that are
successful, have systems in place, and they can find a way to connect with someone to make this
less weird, to make this a conversation about what's really, what's more important to detecting
no assets. So there's a couple of jobs I feel like everybody should do in life. There's a couple
of things I think everybody should do. I think it would totally change their perception of it,
all right? Regardless of having children or not, I think everyone should have the
opportunity to teach a class, preparing curriculum and showing how to teach. I think
everyone should have the opportunity of serving someone in a restaurant or a volunteer type
of thing, you know, volunteer fashion. The other thing I would say is everyone is not
running for political office. I feel like everyone should help in a campaign for political office.
I think that these are very humbling experiences. It is not about you. It's about someone else.
It's you giving of yourself to others, and it really, really calls on you to be vulnerable.
So I think those are the things that you, I think everybody should do. I'm sure there's others.
Hey, this is why we're friends, because I've done all three.
There we go. There we go. The trifecta.
Right? I've been a bartender in a university college, and I worked on several presidential
campaigns because I have a degree in political science. And so you're right.
It's fantastic. Yeah, yeah. Do those. Yeah, amazing. Those three things. You can make it,
right? You can do anything. Now we're in New York. We can do anything, right? Anything's possible.
Yeah, those are things that are important. So you said that I haven't actually read the book.
It's Emyth Mastery by Michael Gerber is at the book. That is the book. I'm adding it's my list.
It's going to be the next book I listen to. It's written in a way. We've all read those business
books. They're just so technical. It's like, oh my God, I need an MBA and an MBA on top of the
MBA to be able to understand this. They tell us, they tell it in a story sense. They tell it in a
story way. I love that. I love that. Well, I'm going to add it to my list. There's another book
that talks a little bit about sales. It's called To Sell As Human. I don't know if you read that
one. I think it's by Dan Pink. That's a good one. It just talks about natural. For me,
I started in claims. I did claims for five years and then a mentor is like, you should come over
the sales team. I'm like, you're insane. I'm not a salesperson. What are you talking about?
Sales is yucky. It sounds gross. He's like, what are you talking about? He's like, you do sales
every day in claims. You have to sell the client that their car is fixed properly. I was like,
and then it didn't feel yucky anymore. Then the whole Dan Pink book talks about
actually sales is not yucky. If you do it the right way, it's like everybody does it every
single day because if someone cuts you off, like you were saying, it's their fault. It's not your
fault. You got to sell them on that. Anyway, we can keep going down that. I just wanted to follow
up with you though on one specific question. Let me kind of touch around a little bit with
sales performance, but what's your thought if you're mentoring someone or you're coaching someone
on your team that's underperforming? You kind of got the three options. You got the stick,
you got the carrot. How do you determine what makes sense? Do you decide to push them? Do you
decide to use a carrot? What's your thoughts around that? Because I think everyone listening
has had something like this. Either it's on their drug team or it's a friend or someone's
and it just got written up. It's not my fault. We're saying it earlier. My boss just hates me
or you have someone on your team that's, hey, I need to get in the game. I need you to do this
better. What's your thoughts around relationships around that? Someone's performing poorly. I
think the first thing I'd like to do is just get an idea of how they feel they're doing. To me,
that is powerful. I can't tell you how many couples I've talked to on this answer. How many,
the male counterpart of a relationship. You tell them, hey, the relationship's in trouble.
We have this, we have that. Like, okay, well, we're good friends and I talked to you in the last
couple of weeks, last couple of months, you never told me that there was an issue. Yeah, man,
it kind of just surprised me because it took me by surprise that she's this unhappy or
he's this unhappy. I think that is failure, I feel, to do what we call a farmer's friendly
review, like right before renewal, right? We talk to the customer and kind of figure out where
they're at and discover things. So I think the first thing I want to do is to do a review, like,
hey, what's the reason why you're in the business in the first place? What's your why? And then you
just start asking more questions. What's the why behind that? What's the why behind that? If someone
had done that to me a while ago, I was an agent. I had ramming agents for three years and there
was definitely some lean years and that up and down with sales and whatnot. If someone had sat
down and talked to me about it, and if I was truly honest in regards to how much time up it
into the business versus time trying to be a musician, trying to come out with an album,
trying to come up with songs, concepts, some of them easily be able to tell the case. Toby's
mind is not in business. Okay, well, Toby, can you afford not to be in the business? Can you
afford for this to fail? No, I can't. All right, so we have all these priorities. Where do you
think you need to put your time or two is without this? And Timmy, that's a way of
them answering the question more than them answering the question. They're all a question
and kind of figuring it out. And if they don't see it, then they don't see it. I mean, Brian,
you've talked before, we know that in order to teach, you have to have two things that exist. One,
you have to have someone that has information and wants to share. You have to have someone that
needs the information and will listen so they can receive it. We'll have a mindset
of wanting to receive the information. If they don't receive it, then there's really not too much
that you can do. Change only happens when one person or one side of the lens. You should look
at chemistry, right? Or you can look at electrons, an atom being pulled from one atom to another
atom. The other atom that pulled it over had expended energy to pull that over. It wouldn't
have happened without energy to be expended. So my question is on time with some of this,
one of the first things I attacked is that how are you allocated over time? Are you
spending it or are you investing it? Because if you're spending it, right, we're not expecting
return on the investment in the time. If we're investing it, well, how are we investing it and
what is a return on investment for the time? So I'd like to start with that. And then also kind
of ask them their why and then also how they see themselves as an individual. I just had this happen
with one of my agents where we talked about his goals. And this agent told me that his goals,
he had a pretty tough upbringing, lean upbringing, no silver spoon in his mouth or anything like that.
Doesn't come from a lot of money. But he told me that his goal was to be a business owner.
That was my goal. His numbers were fantastic and they kind of fell off. So then I talked to him
and said, well, that's interesting that you said that. I think that your problem is that you haven't
changed your goal. You accomplished your goal. And now we need to evolve the goal. Okay, so now
you're here and man, I honestly, I think you set your goals to wealth. We're there. If the goal of
a man is to be married or a girl for a woman is to be married, well, hey, that means that on the
altar, her goal or his goals are being accomplished. What is there to power them to the next 10, 20,
30, 40 years? There's nothing that the goal has got to change. Now my goal should be to be a good
husband, to be a good provider. It's different. So we need to be constantly changing the goals,
evolving. Where's your vision board at? How do you see yourselves? So I mean, so it's a couple
of different things, but I think all of that has to kind of come into play. If someone says they're
a good agent, I'm like, what's your definition of a good agent? What's the definition of a good
secretary? Right now, $5,000 a month in premium is not good. Because if you think you're good,
then this other guy over here is the best and they're not the best. So let's just start with,
I like to start with Sacks first and kind of go from there. Solid advice. I couldn't agree more.
I think sometimes we just like to jump in and assume we're on the same page. And you realize
very quickly that one person, I'm on Everest, and the other person's the Mariana Trench.
Here's where you get. Yeah. Yeah. And it's a beautiful thing because it means there's always
room to grow. And again, as we kind of circle back to the beginning of our conversation,
we win or we learn it's never a bad time to learn. Thank you. We're coming up on kind of our time
today. And before we go, I really just want to try to get into some really, and you've shared so
much wisdom today and really appreciate it. For the listeners who want to grow as leaders or
coaches themselves and starting today, can we start with a simple habit or mindset shift
that you'd recommend as the first thing that they do? And it could be one of the
chords that you talk about in your book. It could be something else. But if someone were to
finish this podcast episode, and they're going back into their daily life, what's like the one
message that you'd really want to land for them to remember and just start implementing today?
Yeah. Great question. So here's what I would say with that. I think I'm going to go to the
empowerment chords of one of the first chords, the first chords or lessons that I have in the
book is treat everything like it's an interview. Treat every interaction like it's an interview.
Okay. So why do I say that? Well, as a person that's interviewed thousands of people,
as long as things are in person through Zoom, I think there's a responsibility on both sides.
The interviewer needs to be informed about who he or she is talking to. I need to have
to be familiar with the resume for the best outcome of said interview. The person that is
being interviewed, that person needs to know a little bit of information about
the opportunity, obviously, and know a lot of information about what they bring to the table
and what the resume says that kind of works or will provide a smooth transition and success.
All right. To all sin and lies, we have these interactions. I don't think there's anything,
I don't believe in coincidence. I believe in prayer and preparation. I don't believe in luck,
I should say. I believe in prayer and preparation. So I feel like all of these interactions are
meant to happen. I think I was meant to meet Brian when I did meet Brian. I was meant to meet Lauren
who introduced Brian to me when I did. And it's for a reason. I didn't know I was even writing
another book, but the book was called at that time. I certainly didn't know I was running for
city council or anything like that. I think it happens for a reason. But I treated it,
that conversation, lights, and interview. And the best interview is one where vulnerability
is given. You don't take licenses to get involved with insurance to get appointed.
John, I'm telling you right now, listen, there are only one or two people that have taken the test
more times than I have. That's how many times that I failed that bad boy. For a myriad of reasons,
all right? But just being honest, right? Just being honest. So when I'm interviewing people and
they tell me they can't do it, they just can't get passed through having issues, I'm able to
pull upon that experience like, brah, like listen, you know, from a person that failed so much that
I switched different locations to take the test. And then I ended up switching that location back
to the original place. And when I finally passed John, listen, when I finally passed the lady that
was the administrator folks, it's like, Mary, he did it. Oh my God, praise Jesus. He did it, Mary.
You know, so I feel strongly that, you know, being vulnerable is important. Part of the interview
process. You've got to look right, smell right, we're going to talk right and just be prepared.
But imagine if we did that, if we had that same role in place when we talk to our spouses,
when we talk to our children, when we talk to our pastors, when we talk to teachers,
police officers, people that you meet in the grocery store. Imagine where we used to go
in the opportunities that would open up if you approach everything like it's an interview.
It's different. It's different. Your questions, you are in an interview, you're present.
In too many times, we are not present in these conversations. Now, here's the bad thing, John,
I just said all this on a pod and my wife's going to listen to it, say, you're not treating
you don't listen to me, you're not present. So no one's perfect, but I think that that's the
aspiration to be. No, that's solid advice, Toby. I was just, a mentor is telling me today, like
similar, like you're just describing, I was talking about a conversation I was going to have,
and she's like, well, how would you have it if it's a customer? And I was like,
oh, that's interesting. I'd have it differently. She's like, why would you have it differently
if it's a customer versus a friend versus a coworker? And so I like, I like what you're
saying too, like treat everything like in your view, have maybe all the conversations,
like you talk to clients and customers differently, you just do, right? So I like that. I like how
that tied together. So we have like one second left, but I have to ask, I have to ask how in
the world did you decide to get into politics and run for city council? You got to tell us a
little bit about that before we let you go. It was a lot of different, a lot of different things.
And I feel like we have a very negative connotation. The world is upside down right now. The world's
upside down a lot of different ways. I'm the kind of person built that is open to having any
conversation with people. I used to say most conversations with people, I'm open. We need
leaders that are willing to do that, willing to move themselves physically or mentally to
have the conversation. My problem with insurance is interesting how people pay for a policy.
And then when a claim happens, they don't know all what's covered in the claim, but they pay for it.
In a city situation for city council, you know, the community pays for these people to make the
best decisions that actually reflect what they bought. But if they're not getting it,
they need to know why, what happened. You know, I try to be as transparent as I can possibly be.
I think we needed more transparency in not just in our community, but in other communities.
And we have a great community here, but I want more transparency in regards to
how decisions are made. And I want to help. I just really want to help. And I do think that
I'm a good connector and to connecting two sides might be opposing sides and getting things done.
This is going to take a little bit of everyone. That's why the colors for the campaign is purple
because blue and red make purple. I don't care how you vote it. It doesn't matter to me how you
voted in the past. I know that we love the city. And that's a common start for I think that we
can build on. We want a good library. We want good roads. We want to feel safe and secure. We want
affordable housing for first-time home buyers. And we also want the next generation of seniors
that has put their blood, sweat, and tears into this community to be able to retire
in place with dignity and make sure that it's affordable. You want diverse communities to
make sure that their voices are heard and established ways and, you know, that the dialogue
can be exchanged between both of these groups, whether they're at a different ethnicity or
a different age or religious beliefs. So it takes all of that. And so from a person that,
you know, was raised Christian, you know, married to a woman that was raised Hindu. It's a person
that was oftentimes the only black kid in an all-white class, but went to a school who had a
black community that was larger than some of the HBCUs. Then a business leader and a motivational
speaker, a person that loves music because music is the universal language that connects everybody
regardless of your political meanings. I feel like this is the next step for me to take. That's
why I wrote it. Thank you for sharing. And I just want to say, I think most people, regardless of
political opinions, can appreciate and resonate with what you just said. And also the fact that,
and it's an inspiring thing, because it's easy to say and hard to do, that you saw an opportunity,
you saw something that you felt wasn't working as well as it could. You saw an area where you
felt you could contribute. And instead of complaining about it, you threw yourself into it and you
said, I want to give what I have and I want to try to make things better. And that is an inspiring
choice. And I think that's great that you are doing that and wish you the best of luck in getting
that and in helping your community. Thank you, man. Appreciate it. You know, obviously we're
thinking about victory, right? But if we don't get the outcome we want, you know, two things I
will say with that, hey, we learned, right? And the second thing I will say is, you know, what we
say in church, you know, amen anyway, that's, it is what it is. So if we move on, we'll be fine.
And there's plenty of ways to help. And I will continue down this path as far as helping whatever
community that I live in. So yeah, there's that mindset and living it, dreaming it. So Toby,
thank you, my friend. I wish we had another couple of hours. We'll do another one of these.
You're not going to be like the one and done. You're going to be a guest the next time.
No, no coach Calipari, the one and done. I love it. I love it. Hey, thanks for coming on. We
appreciate you. Thank you, Toby. Appreciate you guys. Wow, Brian, what a conversation. I feel
like we could have gone another hour with Toby and still just scratched the surface. I know, right?
I'm so glad you joined us. What I love is when a guest can bounce from music to sales to politics
to mindset and somehow relate all back together and how you can lead and grow your business.
There's so many great nuggets from this conversation. All right, well, let's do what we do
and let's pull out a few of the big ones for our listeners, especially the folks that are
leading teams are trying to level up as producers. The first one I keep coming back to is Toby's
idea of tuning into frequencies. This one really resonated with me. That image of moving the antenna
to get a clear signal and I can definitely see myself back in the late 80s, early 90s trying to
do that. That's really, in this context, that's emotional intelligence and action.
Yeah, I wrote that one down too. And also you move first, right? So instead of saying something like
who's ever said this client's really difficult or this producer just doesn't get it,
instead of asking, what do I need to adjust? Do I need more humor? Do I need to share some
vulnerability, maybe give the person a tougher challenge, maybe listening ears show some empathy
for agents, right? That's huge. The ability to read the room, match your client's wavelength
is often the difference when getting a quote that dies and a relationship that lasts for years.
Yeah, and Toby, what I loved about it is Toby is not talking about being fake. That is not what
this is about. It's really the way he framed it. It's about being willing to listen and invest
your energy to really understand someone. That's a leadership skill, a sales skill,
and honestly, just like a great human skill to develop. Now, the second big theme that I want
to talk about with you is his take on mindset and failure. He said it as we either win or we
learn and I just love that framing. Yes, yeah, I loved how he tied it to sales performance when
we talked about that, right? So the part he said was sales actually doesn't start until a customer
says no. So that's when you decide, am I going to get defensive and blame the ref? Am I just going
to walk away, take my ball and go home? I don't think anyone else want to do that or how are you
going to learn from it, right? For leaders, that's the mindset we can model to our teams. When your
team misses a goal or misses out on a big sale, instead of saying, ah, you know, we blew it,
you can say, all right, well, we didn't get this win. But what did we learn from and how
we're going to change to win the next one? Yeah, and then he also did a great job of connecting
that discomfort and using that as a growth signal. Whether it's taking more swings and sales or
sitting in a tough coaching conversation, it's really about understanding that discomfort equals
growth and that when you feel discomfort, that's a signal to you that you are challenging yourself
and when you're challenging yourself, you're growing. Now, the third big takeaway from this
conversation for me, and we touched on it earlier, was his friendship and corporate concept. And
Brian, I think you have some insight here. Yeah, like, so Toby and others, I used to have a mentor
of mine, Jack, who said the same thing. Like, he asked me this one time, he's like, who's on your
personal board of directors? And Toby, you said board of advisors, whatever you want to say. But
that is friends, mentors, colleagues, ex-co-workers who you quote unquote, hire to help you in
different areas of your life. And I actually use this of asked people, it kind of sounds weird,
but I'm like, will you join my, will you join my personal board of directors? But for our audience,
or anyone listening, you know, just think about this, it doesn't have to be formal like I do,
but a peer who pushes you on production and processes, or maybe a mentor helps you think
long term about your career, what do you want to do in the next 15 years? Or maybe a community
member, or another agency owner even, who gets your world, you know, maybe a competitor that helps
push you. All of these people on your own quote unquote board of directors, and I have this,
and it really works. You know exactly when you can call someone and ask for advice. I loved
his ideas around this. That was a big one for me. That's a takeaway that I'm for sure will be
implementing and thinking a little bit more about. I love that framing. He did a really good job too
of throughout the entire conversation, you know, woven through all the different aspects that we
talked about. Well, as this line from as one of his books, if you can change your perspective,
you can find your power. And I think we see that work in our work with agents all the time.
Sometimes the difference between plateauing and growing is literally just reframing a slow month
as looking at that as data. What happened that month? What trends are we seeing when I reflect
on my meetings and my calls and my interactions? What can I learn from that in Garner? If I'm
having a slow month, maybe it's a tough client, you know, using that as practice for tuning your
frequency, you know, use that opportunity to grow and develop yourself. And maybe it's a setback
as part of your Everest climb. We talked about how, and Brian, you shared this where, you know,
when you climb Everest, you actually spend more time climbing down than you do climbing back up
because it helps you acclimate to that growth and to that change. And so think about that setback
that you may have as maybe just a climb down to a lower base camp, knowing that it's not the end
of the story that you're going to climb back up to an even higher level. Yeah, totally. I think
he kind of left us with the last one for me resonated was treat every interaction like it's
an interview. Or like I said, during the conversation, treat every interaction like you're
talking to a client, like why do we treat our staff maybe different? Or why do we treat
client interactions different or an interview? Like interview is showing up, right? You're being
your best self, you're prepared, present, knowing what you bring to the table, confident,
and generally curious about the person across from you. So imagine if you could do it for one day,
every single client call, every single team one on one, every single carrier meeting,
you showed up like it's an interview, what would that do? And how would it change your
culture and your results? I think it looked different. Agree. And so we've got so much from
Toby, you know, Brian and I took a lot away from this that we're sharing with you. So at this point,
you're listening and wondering, okay, so like, now what do I do with this? What do I do with
this episode? I think this is a really simple starting point. This week, this month, pick one
relationship, a client, a team member, could even be a family member, and just intentionally treat
your next conversation like an interview, you know, be prepared, show up a couple minutes early
mentally, right? Get mentally prepared for this conversation, be present, turn the phone off,
put it away, really focus on the person you're talking to and think about what you want to learn
from them. Know what you bring to the table. What do you want them to understand about you
and your perspective or the issue at hand that you're having a conversation about? And as Brian
said, be genuinely curious about the other person. And in that, you may need to be willing to get a
little bit more vulnerable than usual, maybe even be a little bit more vulnerable than the other person.
And then do that and see what changes. Yeah. And I'll just add one thing. Maybe ask your team
next, you know, rather than treating the no as the finish line, treating as a starting line,
that's really the pure empowerment accords that he talked about.
That's right. And with that, we really want to give a huge thanks again to Toby Braswell
for joining us and sharing just so openly and so deeply. And if you want to go deeper,
we'll have more about Toby, his books, his podcasts, and all the other things he's got going on in
our show notes. Yes. If this conversation sparks something in you, please share this episode.
We want to do more of this mindset leadership coaching. So share the episode with a colleague,
forward it to another agency owner, play a clip in your sales meeting, use as a launchpad for a
team discussion. That would mean the world to us. That's right. And if you want more information
on working with Hagerty, if you want more information on the collector vehicle market
and how you can grow your business and your career through this amazing collector car niche,
head on over to HagertyAgent.com. And as always, make sure you're following the accelerator wherever
you get your podcasts so you don't miss future episodes. Thanks everyone. Keep tuning those
frequencies and keep your clients protected with what they love. And with that, we'll see you next
time on The Accelerator and never stop driving.
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