CarCast+Edmunds - New Nissan Leaf driving impressions. Alistair’s review of the 911 Carrera T and the latest U-Drags race between the Corvette E-Ray vs the Porsche 911 4 GTS T-Hybrid.

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Drinking and driving will change your whole world.

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Hello, welcome to the Admin's Car Cast Podcast.

I'm not the moderator, D'Andrea, here with Aleister Weaver.

How are you?

I'm good, thanks, Matt.

You guys always have a big end of the year crunch.

When most people are kind of wanting

to check out a little bit, you know,

somewhere between Thanksgiving and the new year,

I just want to, like, kind of phone it in a little bit more.

But somehow you guys manage to do this big end of the year crunch

as part of your business model.

It's Killy.

I was just talking to Matt Offair and saying how, you know,

it's a crazy, crazy time of year for us.

We have our awards, which go live in February this year,

but actually all the content shot next week.

And Thanksgiving was late this year,

so it's been a big sort of compression.

So next week is going to be like a 60-70 hour week for sure.

And then I've kind of got my end of year,

couple of end of year parties as well, and then I head to Europe.

So it's a bit of a crazy time.

It's always the way that we try and run the business

so we give people a bit of a break over the holiday season.

But that means we all kind of, like, work ourselves into the ground

so that we can kind of, you know, enjoy the holiday season.

So it works out, but it's a big effort right now.

Yeah, it's a lot to jam in.

When we talked about it last year as well,

when the awards were coming out,

sort of what's involved with getting this done.

And there's just so many cars and so much number crunching

and then the filming process and, you know,

in the testing process, like, it's just, I mean,

it's kind of done throughout the year,

but man, just jamming it all into sort of one big presentation.

It's it's way more involved than you would.

Oh, yeah, we're talking like 10.

Yeah, I don't even know how many individual pieces of content,

but it's, you know, it's it's it's tens of piece,

individual pieces of content.

So as I speak, I've got a front, a lot of this on on Monday,

then across the rest of the week.

So it's like I'm now paranoid about getting ill.

So, you know, every time the kids give me a hug,

I get a little bit paranoid, but yeah, we shall see.

So I'm glad we're doing this on Zoom.

So because I understand you've got a cult.

Yeah, you know, I just it was just time.

It was like I was at the SEMA show

and I was like, I just want to get to the SEMA show

and have it be fine.

And I came back and it was mostly fine.

And now it's just finally catching up with me

and I'm just trying to figure out, like,

is now the right time is now the worst time

like before Christmas, after SEMA, after Thanksgiving.

So maybe maybe I should just get it out of my system

and then get on now.

So now is the time to get it.

That's probably the time.

I mean, I rather not.

But yeah, now is the time I was actually last night

in my my local my local town that every year

they have a Santa's float that comes around.

Yeah, which is a Santa sitting

with like two surfboards behind him.

It's a really nice thing for the kids

and there's like a little app with a Santa tracker

and so you run out your house

when he arrives nearby and stuff.

And it's very it's very cute.

But I didn't feel for the guy

because he's basically got like several hundred.

You know, the course of a week

goes around the whole area.

So it's probably got like two thousand kids

like sitting, you know, coming and sitting next

to him, it's like this guy's got to get ill.

Yeah, I hope in hell.

Yeah, he only works one month a year.

Yeah. Yeah, I don't think he's got a big week coming up.

He's got a big week coming up as well.

He's been prepping the whole time.

I hope my kids aren't listening to this

because it's going to ruin the moment.

Well, I was going to I was going to ruin it,

but I don't want to.

No, keep the belief.

All right. So some interesting things

that you've been into recently

and a new you drags video.

But let's start with the Nissan Leaf

because we we talked a little bit about that.

The leaf when it first came out was, I don't know,

very underwhelming for me.

It was one of the first EVs I ever drove.

And I remember just getting on to the to the 405 down here.

And it was just suck in the battery way.

Now, like whatever the range was,

it said I had like 60 miles range,

but not at highway speeds.

Like nobody really figured that out yet.

So it was just and then

I basically didn't make it.

And I had to call Toyota.

I'm like, your car's on the side of the road.

I'm going to Uber home.

Like, I don't know why you call Toyota,

if it was a Nissan, but anyway.

Yeah, Nissan. Sorry. Yeah.

The Nissan Leaf.

I probably, you know what it was?

I was near where Toyota was before they went to Texas.

So I would have been interested.

I might have had some fun with.

They're probably looking out the windows, having a laugh.

Yeah. Like, look at that guy stuck

in his Nissan Leaf out there.

The new ones vastly different.

It's kind of interesting when you reflect on the leaf

because everybody thinks about Tesla

as being the founding fathers electric car,

but it was actually Nissan that really led the way

with those early, early Leafs

that are sort of semi affordable pricing.

Right. They didn't have a lot of range.

I was looking, I didn't quit Google early

and you can pick up used Leafs for next to no money.

And the reality is if you're,

if you're looking at as like a second or third car

for running around town,

they probably still make a lot of sense.

If it's got a hundred miles or whatever range left.

Actually, you know, might make a lot of sense to people

as a, as a, as an additional car for next to no money.

Yeah. The new one, the previous generations,

I mean, the first one was kind of odd looking as well,

wasn't it? But the,

now it's kind of morph like everything else

from being a hatchback into something more akin to an SUV.

It's a sort of kind of curious, almost like a,

like a fastback at the moment.

It looks a bit like a kind of scaled down

Mercedes GLE Coupe.

It's an interesting looking thing.

And the big push as always with the Leaf was

we're going to make it,

we're going to make it affordable.

So it starts at about 30 grand

or just over 30 grand with destination.

It goes a long way.

We did the Edmunds EV range test doing over 300 miles.

So this is like a, you know, as you say, the,

the original Nissan Leaf was kind of, you know,

a first foray into the market,

but this is a very usable car at a,

at a very sensible price point.

The first one was like a hundred miles of range.

And that's if you're lucky going downhill.

Whereas this thing's got, you know,

over 300 miles on our Edmunds EV range test,

charge it with a, with the Tesla, you know,

the Tesla charge, there's a lot of things,

a lot of things in its favor.

It's a decent size.

There's not tons of space in the, in the rear,

but it's a decent size.

It's got Apple CarPlay, Android Auto.

It's, you know, there's a lot going for it.

The only challenge for it really is at 30 grand,

I think it starts to make a lot of,

makes a lot of sense.

But then if you go up a trim or up a trim again,

and the one that I've got is, is the sort of top trim.

And then you've got like bows surround sound

and all sorts of things.

Then you're getting close to 40 grand and you're like,

well, I can get a Model 3, a Tesla Model 3

standard edition for 38.

I can get an IONIQ 5 for 35.

And I think that's Nissan's challenge

that you start off and say 31 sounds like a great deal.

But then there's a lot of other cars in that market

that once you get to say 35, you know,

an IONIQ 5 is, is a much bigger,

more sophisticated car than the Leaf.

Plus you're up against used EVs

and you're up against all the gas alternatives,

which, you know, Nissan, you know,

Nissan does plenty of, you know,

the Rogue starts at the same price as the,

as the Leaf and the Rogue is, you know,

a much bigger SUV than, than the Leaf.

So, you know, it's not, it's not straightforward.

And, but it's, you know,

it's an interesting choice at a, at a sensible price point.

Looking at a few of the photos,

it looks like it has both the Tesla plug

and the other plug.

Yeah, I think that's generally the,

I can't remember which way to set it up.

I think, well, you also,

I remember you have the fast charging in the Tesla,

then you also have the level two charging as well

for when you're at home.

So there's, you know, different, different combinations,

but it, you know, it's a vast improvement on the old car.

You know, you can debate the appearance,

but that, that kind of hatchback tail gives it,

gives it some practicality.

The interior technology works pretty well.

You know, the, the, some of the plastics,

they've aren't, you know, like mega premium,

but then it's a 30 grand car.

So looking at some of the competitors

in this price range, like, is it Chevy Equinox?

Yeah, Equinox EV.

Yeah, and you said Ionic five.

I mean, the Ionic five is intricate

because Hyundai has just decided

that we're going to throw a load of money

against the Ionic five and they want to sell volume.

So suddenly that's getting it under 40 grand.

Tesla has the Model three at 38 grand,

the, the Model three standard,

which is a really good car.

And, you know, it feels like a more premium alternative.

So there is now like genuine choice

in that 30 to 40 grand mark for, for EVs.

And I think, you know, most,

let's face it, a lot of,

a lot of families in the US are two car families

or sometimes more than two car families.

So, you know, this sort of car

is an interesting alternative.

Maybe as a second car, you know,

maybe this isn't your big road trip car

because it's size and scale.

But, you know, if this is a, you know,

this is a decent car for, for running around.

Yeah. And we're flicking through a couple of the images.

I mean, and the interior looks good.

I mean, the interior looks good to me.

I mean, compared to, we were talking before about

where you cut some of your prices

on like a cheap plastic steering wheel and stuff,

but it seems like it's pretty good.

I don't know.

I mean, we're probably looking at the higher trim model.

Yeah. I think you are, you are looking

at higher trim than I might, but I was looking,

and I've got the higher trim,

but I'm also looking at the spec of the entry level.

And, you know, they've,

they've got wireless car play

or wireless Android Auto.

So once you've got that, you can have done,

you know, this we talked a lot about on the show

about like the democratization of technology.

And it's like, well, I don't need like built in Google.

I don't need, you know,

I don't necessarily need Bose surround sound.

There's a lot of stuff you don't need.

If you give me car play or you give me Android Auto,

then I've got all the music.

I've got all my telephone functionality.

I've got all my navigation functionality

because my smartphone already does that.

So I'm done.

Yeah.

And after that, I don't, you know,

the rest of it's just, just window dressing.

I mean, I drive so many cars that have got, you know,

Google integration or this and that.

And you're like, well, why am I paying for this?

Cause my phone does this.

And I think that's why actually Toyota have been quite smart.

Yeah. They charge you a subscription

if you want to do it through your car,

but probably accept that most people

are just using car play anyway.

Yeah.

And I mean, even that's what I'm doing.

I just like when I get in my car,

it's all like all the maps, everything's just car play.

I'm still waiting for more cars

to be able to have some sort of split screen

where you can change the presets on your radio

while you're using car play

instead of switching back and forth to car play,

which seems annoying.

There's only a couple of cars that I've seen

that are doing that, but.

I think we're also seeing now more integration.

So I, you know, I was in the Lexus GX last week

and now like Google Maps from car play

is now in the head up display system

and things like that.

So, you know, it's not, it used to be,

here's the car and here's Apple or here's Google.

And I think everything's getting a lot better integrated.

So that's kind of good to see as well.

And also kind of what I do like about the Leaf,

you know, we talked before about,

and we were talking about the Cayenne EV,

weren't we, last week about like stupid,

you know, 1100 horsepower.

The Leaf's not like that.

It's like fast enough.

It's quite, you know, it pulls quite nicely.

It's fine.

It's front wheel drive.

It's like a sensible little car.

And I kind of like that.

It's honest.

I mean, there's two levels of horsepower.

The base is the Leaf S, 174 horsepower.

And then there's like an S Plus or a Platinum Plus

and it's 214 horsepower.

But I don't know, does it affect the range that much?

Cause I would kind of just go for the most range

with this car.

Well, and also probably, you know, 170 horsepower.

So, you know, you're not really buying this to go fast.

Yeah.

And I think a lot of these cars tend to work better

at their lower trims.

I mean, things like the Nissan Kicks as well,

which, you know, Nissan is pitching itself

as being a value alternative.

And you know, one of their big calling cars

is we have plenty of cars under 30 grand.

And, you know, it's, we were talking,

Michelle, a couple of weeks ago,

I spent time with one of their marketing executives

and he said, what we're trying to do

is come up with cars with the functions

that people want and get rid of engineering

and stuff that they don't want,

which just adds cost to nobody

that people don't care about.

And I think that's very, very sensible.

And most of their range makes more sense

at the lower price point.

So I remember driving a Kicks,

which was in the, you know, 30 plus ground

and you're like, it doesn't make sense of this money.

Whereas, you know, at sort of a little,

you know, 20 grand or a little over 20 grand,

then actually it's a great value proposition.

And again, as we said, your car player, whatever,

then you don't really feel like you're wanting for much.

You know, we talked about a competitor being the IONIQ 5,

but we don't really talk much about like Kona and Nero.

Yeah, you're right.

And actually they're sometimes overlooked

because there are cars that are offered in gas

and everything else as well.

But, you know, both of those

are sort of decent, honest, little EVs.

Yeah.

And you're right.

And they're small.

They're smallish, yeah.

And they do, you're right.

They sort of fly under the radar a little bit.

Yeah.

I guess, yeah, I'm not sure why it hasn't really come up

in conversation that much, but there's,

I mean, I guess I have to kind of look at the sales figures.

It looks like IONIQ 5 just sort of took off as being,

you know, the cool kid of that lineup of, you know,

the EV lineup, the sort of the compact EV lineup,

but they've got to be selling them.

They've got to be...

Yeah. And I think that like the Kona Electric

is from like 33 grand-ish.

Yeah. I think the IONIQ, the trouble with the EVs

is they sell as many as they're willing to put money

against, particularly at the moment.

I mean, we're starting to see figures come through

from like October.

Not surprising because the tax credit

at the end of September that there's a massive crash.

Because if you wanted an EV,

you were going to buy in September.

So it's not surprising that nobody bought them in October.

But what's happening in the market,

what seems to be happening in the market at the moment is,

if a manufacturer wants to shift EVs,

they have to put money against it.

And I think that's what Hyundai is doing with the IONIQ 5.

So make money on the Palisade, lose money on the IONIQ.

And then kind of hope that the market comes to them.

I mean, Ford's got that problem.

Ford's got backed up.

Ford's got more F-150 Lightnings

that he knows what to do with.

They've got more Mackies than they know what to do with.

They're not building any Lightnings at the moment,

but they've still got plenty to sell

through the next model year.

I don't think they're going to build any at all.

I think they're kind of done with that.

That's the thing, it's suspended.

Nissan said the same thing with the Aria.

I was like, oh, an Aria's gone.

No, well, no, it's suspended.

I mean, what does that mean?

Yeah, it's debatable whether Lightning comes back at all.

But in the meantime, they've got a hell of a lot to shift.

Yes, they do.

And I don't even see the ads popping up too much on those.

But when you do a holiday break, you do something like Thanksgiving

and all the dealers want to start pushing deals,

trying to get you in for that weekend.

I was getting all kinds of ads for Mach-E.

Oh, yeah, on a lease deal at the moment.

Mach-E, they just got a...

I remember coming out of the pandemic

when we got the Genesis going into a Ford dealer

and being quoted like 900 bucks a month on a three-year lease.

And I was like, that's insane. I'm not doing that.

Yeah.

And getting this whole narrative,

oh, well, we've got supply problems.

He said, but we've suddenly got 20 in stock.

That's very unusual for us.

And I was like, yeah, I think this is the sign of the times.

And now, 250 bucks a month.

Yeah.

So either they were getting incredibly fat

on 900 bucks a month, probably,

but are they making money at 250 bucks? No.

So...

No, but definitely keep in mind

when you read the fine print, they'll go, listen,

for 450 a month, you can come in at zero down

and lease this thing.

At 250 a month, you got to come in with like 6,000 down.

Yeah, the scary thing is that that's right.

You've got to look at the overall cost.

And really, you've got to look at the overall cost

across the life of your lease.

You're right.

But sometimes you look at these deals and you think,

ah, well, the fine print is going to tell me

that it's 10 grand down.

And then you look at the fine print and you go,

wow, it's two grand down, you know,

that they really are, they really got problems.

They just got massive oversupply

and you've got to get rid of them.

And this has been the, you know,

this is the problem right now.

Yeah.

All right, let's take a quick break

and we've got some fun stuff to take.

We'll be right back.

Hey guys, it's Matt again.

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This podcast is supported by The Real Real.

Meet Christine.

She loves shopping.

And this is the sound of fashion overload.

Too many fabulous things, not enough space.

So Christine started selling with The Real Real.

I've always loved collecting designer pieces.

Gucci bags, Prada heels.

But my style keeps evolving.

Selling with The Real Real, game changer.

I earn more and they do everything.

Seriously, just drop off your items or schedule a pickup.

We handle the photos, descriptions, pricing, even shipping.

You just sit back and watch your items sell fast

to our 38 million members.

And I get peace of mind knowing I earn more selling

with The Real Real than anywhere else.

Exactly.

This, that's the sound of your closet working for you.

The Real Real, earn more, save time, sell fast.

And right now, you can get an extra $100 site credit

when you sell for the first time.

Go to TheRealReal.com to get your extra $100.

TheRealReal.com.

That's TheRealReal.com.

OK.

So Nissan Leaf, you drove it.

Like it?

But you like it?

I'm about to swap it tomorrow for Nissan Center as well,

which I think is quite an interesting car.

Again, 30 grand per night.

We just had some data at Edmunds

that the average transaction price the first time

is really nudging on 50 grand now.

Yeah.

Which is not.

The Nissan Leaf, you like it in mostly its base model form,

right?

Long range.

If you're looking at it, I would say get the 30 grand one.

It makes less sense for me.

The ride quality is not fantastic.

It's not the best car to drive.

It's compromising some areas.

But at 30 grand, it's an intriguing proposition

if you want a new EV at a cheaper price point.

Once you get 35 to 40, then I'd be looking at a Model 3

and Ionic 5.

And the other thing with a lot of these cars

is think about it.

The used values of EVs, the depreciation is so bad

that a used EV is actually quite an attractive proposition

to me right now.

We can talk about this on a future show,

but we're about to sell our Macan.

We spent 100 grand on it.

It's done 13,000 miles and been quoted 50.

And it's kind of horrifying that we've dropped 50 grand.

But then at the same time, I was like, well, I have 50 grand.

I might not think it's worth 100 grand, but 50 grand.

That's actually quite an appealing product.

That's a nice car.

Right.

So the market sort of flips on itself.

If you look at a used EV, there's

some fantastic deals to be had.

I agree on that.

I think that I was interested in seeing

what's going to happen to that EV market when the incentives ended

a month or two ago or whatever.

And it hasn't really changed.

It's not like all the used EVs started to really

climb up in price.

The ones that did go up, they went up not even 10%

is what I've seen so far.

Me even just looking at the market on my own truck,

on my lightning, or getting a quote,

like getting a Carmack's quote or whatever,

it's barely changed from six months ago to now.

That's why I think there's actually

quite a lot of attractive deals.

I think there's a lot of the used EVs

make a lot of sense right now.

And people are nervous about them

because of what happens when the warranty runs out

and everything else.

But I think a used Model 3 or something like that,

Tesla Model 3, is actually quite an appealing car

for 25 grand, say.

Yeah.

All right, so another car you drove,

other end of the spectrum, you could probably

get a Nissan Leaf for the price of brake pads and tires

on the next car.

Or the insurance.

Probably just, yeah, the annual insurance fee, who knows.

Although somebody quoted, I'm not going to say which company,

but somebody quoted me 35 grand for a front door the other week.

I was like, the world has gone quite mad.

I said 35 grand is what I spend on a car,

not what I spend on a front door.

But anyway, the other end of the spectrum,

I finally got my pause on a current generation 911 Carrera T.

I love the 991 Carrera T. This is the 992 Carrera T, which

of course is the manual version.

But this has been, you've been a fan of the T

for a long time.

For several years now, you're like, T is the way to go.

It's the most, I don't know, authentic.

I don't want to even say analog because it probably

has still every bit of technology in the world.

But to make it feel analog again,

but the T has always been pretty much

across the range like the enthusiast choice.

So they take the best bits of the GTS,

put it onto a standard Carrera.

It's manual only.

They do it as Coupor or Cabriolet on this generation.

And yeah, it's the pure choice.

It's the, if you're proper enthusiast,

it's almost like the badge to have,

unless you can get into a GT3 or something.

So yeah, I was desperate to drive it.

I really like the standard 911 Carrera.

I think for as a road car, you don't need any more performance.

I prefer the fact that it rides a little bit better

than the S or particularly the GTS,

which get pretty stiff for an everyday car.

Yeah, it's 388 horsepower, doesn't sound like a lot,

but Porsche horses are always proper thoroughbreds.

They say 388 horsepower, but when we put it

to the track, it's always like,

well, it's done zero to 60 in four seconds.

And you're like, well, okay.

So I was very excited to drive this thing.

I think it's great, apart from one really significant issue.

Okay.

Well, two really, one is just the general problem

with the current 911 that it's got really big.

But we can't really change that, that's just what it is.

But the other thing is the gearing.

Because of European emissions regulations

and the way that they measure all that stuff

and fuel consumption and everything else,

the gearing is insanely tall.

So like second gear is geared to well over 70 miles an hour.

So what you want is something that's like really fun

and the gear changes lovely.

It's like, the previous generation manual

was a bit kind of springy.

This is a really nice solid gearbox.

It feels really good.

But you kind of go everywhere in sort of second gear

and third at most.

Once you get past third,

it's like you might, you just go straight to sixth.

So fourth and fifth gear are basically irrelevant.

And if you want to kind of enjoy it and hear the engine

at a speed that's sensible and legal,

you've either got to do it in first or,

well, even second gear, you're getting into illegal speeds.

So it's just such a shame that it just,

it's just crying out for shorter gear ratios

and something that's very kind of bop, bop, bop, bop, bop.

And if you remember with the ST,

that special edition that they did,

which they didn't need to worry about emissions

and blah, blah, blah.

That's why they had the change the flywheel,

the change the clutch,

they changed the gears and everything else.

So, I think it's fabulous, but that is a shame.

Yeah.

I think that long first gear is a trick

that these manufacturers have been doing

to improve that zero to 60 time,

knowing that you can go zero to 60

and still do it in first gear.

And then beyond that, you'd have to shift

because if you needed to add that shift,

you know, it would add a couple of tenths or something.

Yeah, but that's just not what this car's about, right?

I mean, I come out of the one,

I don't know, I'm not coming with a one is geared for 60,

but I mean, two is geared for well over 70.

Yeah.

And you know, so then fourth, fifth, sixth,

the kind of like so close

and kind of irrelevant really are on the road,

which you know, you want to be enjoying

you got this lovely wooden gear stick,

which is a throwback to the old 917,

you know, 970, 917 race car, Le Mans car.

And I mean, it's still the 911 I'd have.

I mean, it's sharp.

It's still the car I'd have actually.

I mean, like if you tell me one car drive every day,

this is still a, and it's a, you know,

in 911 terms, it's sensible money.

The car that we had with the options on it,

all of which were fairly sensible

was like 158 grand,

which these days is actually sensible money for a 911.

You know, I'd have one of these ahead of an S or a GTS

or whatever, but it's just, yeah,

just those little frustration made me think actually,

would I buy a new one of these

or would I buy a used like 997,

which is a couple of generations ago, GTS,

which you're never going to lose money on

because it's a collector's piece.

Yes, it might not have all the latest gadgets,

but you can now retrofit carplay.

I'm a big fan of carplay, as you can tell.

Yeah.

You can retrofit carplay.

I mean, and then you haven't got, you know,

you've got a smaller car.

You've got a more agile car.

You've got a bit more character to it.

I don't know.

It's a, that would be a tough call

and you're never going to lose money.

But I do like this.

Yeah. Okay. I mean, it's good.

And yeah, I'm with you on this.

These days when you have, you know, carplay,

it's, you know, it's such a big selling point

for so many cars now

because it's an easy thing to do to integrate it.

So some of the moves like from GM

and maybe is it Rivian that's like, we're not doing it.

It changes the experience.

We're not doing carplay.

It's kind of a deal killer.

It's all the, I mean, for Rivian,

they're trying to do their own software

but then so same to Tesla.

GM, it's all about like,

the big challenge is who owns the data.

And I think company like GM,

they're saying, well, actually we want to,

you know, we want not to effectively own it all

rather than giving it away.

But then they integrate Google Maps

and everything into their own systems.

But I mean, the weird thing about carplay

that I think most people realize

is carplay is an app.

Yeah.

It's not a, you know, it's different.

It's an app basically

that then gives you functionality.

So it's an interesting mobile.

I think we, I don't think there's any coming back

whatever GM thinks.

I think we're going to end up in a world

where there's more and more Apple

or Google integration into your vehicle.

Because frankly, it's just what people want.

But it does mean that, you know,

I went from a 911 to a Leaf

and had exactly the same interface.

In fact, both of them had like

Bose surround sound as well.

So it was like, it really doesn't feel

that much of a differentiator.

I mean, one of them went like hell

and all the rest of it and the other one didn't, but,

you know, since.

And then, so the Carrera T,

it starts at like 143, but you know, Porsche is, it's.

Yeah.

It's every 150 something.

At least.

Yeah.

I think, I think, I, I did that, you know,

everybody plays a rather arm of the Porsche

configurator in a bored moment.

And I think I'd get one for about like 160 ish.

You know, there's certain little thing.

Like you need the Bose hi-fi

rather than the standard ones.

The standard one's not very good.

And you need a few,

there's like a handful of little things

that you'd add paint or whatever.

But.

You need floor mats and paint.

Yeah, exactly.

You need it delivered.

That always costs you a bit of money.

That's always a thing.

I like the noise me.

Just the whole delivery charge thing.

It's like when you buy a sofa.

Oh, yeah, we're going to charge you like 500 bucks

to get you delivered.

What am I supposed to do?

Can I come and pick it up?

No.

Well, don't charge me for delivering it though.

Yeah.

A little feature that I like is,

we were just looking at it,

but this is a sticker of the shift pattern

in the Porsche.

And it comes on this car

and it's in the side windows of the car.

That's like walking up to somebody's house

and seeing the little alarm sign

that says this house is protected by whatever

because so many young people today

can't even drive stick.

This is like an anti-theft sticker

is going, this car is only in manual.

I'm told about it that way.

Yeah, that's the best security device.

Yeah.

You just walk up on it and go,

what is that weird pattern in the window?

What does that mean?

I go, oh, it's a manual.

Yeah.

Anyway, I like that.

All right.

So keeping on with Porsche,

I was watching the latest U-Drags video.

This one was very exciting

because it was a very close race.

I'm going to bring it up.

You can talk about it.

This, we've got the...

This is the Corvette E-Ray.

This is the Corvette E-Ray

versus the 911 GTS, which is the hybrid,

the T-Rex.

The GTS, as we talked about in a previous show,

this is the car that I thought I was going to be,

thought was going to be like the most fabulous 911

because it's not as,

it's slightly easier to live with than the GT3,

less money, but it's got, it's so much fun.

I mean, don't get me wrong,

I think it's a fabulous piece of engineering,

the way they've integrated the hybrid system is awesome.

I just felt slightly under,

and it's massively fast,

and it does really well in the,

in the kind of Edmonds U-Drags format,

but it's quite different.

We had, we're not going to give the game away slightly,

but we have a race coming up

because we film a whole bunch of these to get,

you know, on a couple of days.

We drove the Carrera S,

and Jonathan and I like got out of the Carrera S,

then got into the GTS

and pretty much expected to be the same thing,

but a bit faster.

It is noticeably different.

It is much more lively,

both under power.

You know, you got to,

I think they deliberately set it up to be

much more tuned to like real enthusiasts

who want a car that moves around and does a lot.

Yeah.

The Carrera S,

Brake, turn,

beautifully responsive,

does everything that you want and expected to do.

GTS, you're like, what,

both of us were like,

whoa, there's really hanging on to it.

You know, you got a little bit about,

you know, getting a bit of push,

you're getting a bit of,

you know, getting slide out of the corners a lot to,

it was much harder to get the best time

out of a GTS than it was out of an S.

It's not just faster version of the same thing.

And also it sounds a bit different.

You know, it doesn't have,

it doesn't quite have that sonorous raw

that the T does or the S does.

And so I'm a bit,

I don't love it as much as I thought I would,

but it is, if you get it right,

it is mighty, mighty fast.

But then so is the E-Ray,

which I think is a massively underrated car.

Yeah.

Speaking of the sound,

it's something that I picked up in the,

in the video that you guys posted,

the interior sound of it,

both cars really just kind of have

an interesting unique sound,

that combination of the electric motors,

and in the E-Rays case, a V8 with electric motors,

what I can pick up on through that microphone

and what I heard in the video, interesting.

It's got a, it's got a kind of a,

it's interesting because you got the engine

and I don't know if it's just happening

naturally with the electric motors

or if they're dialing in that sound a certain way,

but it has an interesting sort of futuristic effect

to it as well.

Yeah. And the GTS is single turbo.

There's like quite a different,

the whole proposition is quite different.

So, but that, that E-Ray,

I mean, it's almost like the forgotten Corvette

because everybody focuses on the,

the Z06 and the ZR1 has been the kind of track inspired

cars and understandably so.

And the E-Ray is kind of slipped in the middle of it's,

maybe it's not, you know, maybe the Corvette owner

isn't saying, I don't want to hybrid,

I don't understand all that,

but it's a really good piece of engineering

and it takes this basic standard Sting-Ray

and then really turns it up.

And what was striking is,

in the U-Dress, of course, you have a very heavy break

then into a, you know, into the U-Turn at the bottom

and the speed that you could carry through the Apex

is crazy.

The race I did against the GTS,

I thought I'd just overcooked it

and I was expecting to basically push too wide

and lose a load of time.

We're going to have to rerun it.

And the thing just, I went for the power

to basically get the almost effectively counteract

the push and the thing just gripped and went.

And if you look like race two,

I think it was probably why I'd better run of any car.

It was just, the thing is good.

And the way to the front end,

there's just counteracts the, you know,

you can use the throttle to balance the,

effectively balance the car.

And it's really, really good.

Some of the cars that have been out there,

sometimes there are issues with hooking up

something you brought up many times with like the GT500.

But man, watching this video,

seeing the difference,

both of these cars launched so hard.

Yeah.

Yeah, it really do.

I mean, obviously both of them have got all-wheel drive.

And, you know, the way they just,

I mean, the Porsche in particular

just sort of picks it up,

itself's up and sort of chucks itself down the road.

But the Corvette was, you know, was right on its heels.

I'm just pulling up the figures on my computer here.

Yeah, I mean, the,

the GTS goes ninth in our leaderboard,

31.6 seconds, 10.9 seconds for the quarter.

I mean, it's only just,

it's only 0.8 of a second behind the outgoing 911 Turbo S.

E-Ray is just a 10th behind it.

It's really that class.

I was going to bring up the leaderboard,

but I didn't know if you wanted to give away the results here.

Oh yeah. Well, you know, you still got to watch it.

I mean, Matt, but-

Yeah, you got to watch the video.

But here's the-

Here's the video, but that GTS is,

you know, it's 9-11.

It's almost 9-11, old 9-11 Turbo fast, not quite,

but you know, you've got some very exotic stuff

ahead of it.

Which interesting to me is I always kind of thought

the E-Ray was supposed to be,

I'm trying to figure out the order of Corvettes.

Is it C8, then is it Sting-Ray,

and then E-Ray, and then Z06,

and then ZR1, and then ZR1X.

I guess that's kind of the order they meant.

I thought maybe E-Ray was supposed to be above Z06,

but I guess not.

That's always been the challenge really,

that the E-Ray and the Z06

are basically the same money.

So it's, I think it's a,

I haven't looked at the recent sales figures,

but it's a tough, it's a tough sell really,

because the Z06 is the flat-plane crank,

and it's the race car for the road,

and it has all that visceral appeal,

and the E-Ray, I think the way that they belt

some of us billing it is the E-Ray is like the GT car.

It's the Sting-Ray with more performance

that you use every day.

The Z06 is more like take it to a track at the weekend.

Whether the Corvette owner really kind of buys into that,

I don't know.

But the E-Ray is a much easier car

to live with day-to-day than the Z06.

But I mean like, I'd have the Z06

because he just sounds unbelievable,

and you've got that throttle response,

and you know, but you haven't got the all-wheel drive,

you haven't got the, you know,

the E-Ray is in the real world,

probably actually a faster vehicle than the Z06 on the road.

But yeah, it's a tough tell for that community as well,

I think.

I mean, watch the video,

but it is really quite startling

how good the E-Ray is relative to the GTS.

We always knew the GTS was going to be really good.

I was surprised how hard you have to work

to get the performance out of it,

which I think is probably a very deliberate thing

from Porsche.

This is going to proper enthusiast car.

But yeah, E-Ray, which are both Jonathan and I,

came away really impressed by it.

Well, it's a fun video to watch.

So definitely do that,

hop onto the Edmunds YouTube channel

and watch the latest U-Drags episode.

Yeah, it's cool, it was fun.

I'm going to go and read the comments.

Reading the comments is always entertaining as well.

I always take out the pinch of salt,

like I'm either the world's best driver,

or the world's worst driver,

there's never anything in between.

Well, this was a good video.

This video made it look like you were the better driver.

So.

Well, that's pretty rare to be honest.

That doesn't normally happen, so.

Jonathan's really, really,

Jonathan's really, really good.

Yeah, he's good, but this one.

Jonathan's a very talented driver,

so he's metronomic.

He's an engineer by schooling,

not a historian like me,

and he cares a lot about it.

He's really, really good.

We're very privileged in the team that we've got.

You know, Jonathan, Kurt Niebuhr as well,

the test team who are really, really talented

and just very, very consistent.

Yeah.

All right, so we're here,

we're recording the show

and a day before Toyota's announcement,

which I'm kind of interested in,

for sure, and for those of you that don't know,

I don't know, this has just been interesting to me.

But we're like a day away from Toyota

sort of unveiling what they've been teasing

the past few days of three new cars,

one of them a racing car,

but the GRGT, which is,

I don't think they want to call it an LFA replacement,

because the LFA was expensive and so good

and 10 cylinder and that.

And was he so good?

I don't know, it's probably a show

for different things.

Did you drive an LFA?

Oh, I drove a bunch of them

and I went to the track with them.

Yeah, I think it's that good.

I went to Nürburgring with it.

I mean, I love the best,

one of the best-selling engines of all time.

That's it, that's the selling point.

It's just the engine.

I thought the rest of the car was a bit like,

well, yeah, nice, but not like,

it doesn't deserve it's like otherworldly reputation.

It's just the engine's unbelievable.

The engine's unbelievable and that's enough.

Like for me, that was enough.

Because, yes, I didn't really,

I don't really think I drove one on the street.

I just drove it on the track for a couple of them.

I got taken around the Nürburgring Nordschleife

by one of the test drivers,

was it Toshiyo Suzuki,

who spoke not a word of English.

There was no telling him to slow down.

And he was just like pointing out or...

He was in a race suit and a helmet

and I was in like a borrowed helmet and jeans.

And I do remember like him applying

quite significant corrections at times

and me thinking, yeah,

this is kind of exciting, but.

Yeah, that's gonna get horribly wrong.

Anyway, so Toyota's gonna have this new,

I don't wanna say super car, it's a sports car,

and then something else.

I don't even remember what the third car was.

Yeah, I mean, they've got,

you look at their range now,

they've got a real spread

and they're trying to bring a bit more excitement

back into stuff and a lot of it came from the top.

Toyota's on at the top of the business

was a real car guy and yeah,

it's, yeah, they're doing well

and I think, you know, of all the companies,

they're the one that's kind of

bet the right way at the moment.

We're gonna do hybrids, we're not gonna go,

we're not gonna bet the farm on EV.

Yes, and this sports car or whatever it's gonna be,

the GR GTs, what they're calling it

is gonna be a V8 hybrid, as far as we know, right?

They're saying we don't need the V10.

Hybrid is the business model, right?

That's what they've been pushing

as the experts in hybrid technology.

So this should be a hybrid.

But look, if you get one out to UDRAX,

if it's anything like that E-Ray

or that Carrera T hybrid.

Yeah, it's getting, everything's getting a bit fast.

You want the ZR,

the Z, you know, wherever it can,

can we beat the ZR1 and I don't know,

ZR1X is the one that we're waiting for.

Yeah, ZR1X, that'll be interesting.

All right, we're gonna wrap things up.

Anything else we got?

No, I think we'll probably talk next week

about, you know, BMW iX3, which is a huge deal for them.

You know, another EV,

but it's very much kind of a generational shift for BMW.

So there's a, you know, there's a lot more coming from them,

which will be both gas and electric.

Yeah, new three series, electric and gas three series.

There's gonna have, you know,

different range of power trains.

There's, you know, normally we get into this time of year

and things quiet and down.

Frankly, this time of year, it's a bit crazy.

So, you know, we are working relentlessly.

Yeah, all right.

All right, so we'll be back next week.

Thanks so much for listening.

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CarCast+Edmunds - New Nissan Leaf driving impressions. Alistair’s review of the 911 Carrera T and the latest U-Drags race between the Corvette E-Ray vs the Porsche 911 4 GTS T-Hybrid.

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