F1 2025 Season Review! New EV/ICE regulations in the EU?| The Car Podcast #65

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65. We never thought we'd get here, but we have. If you put a three in between the six and the five,

you have one of my favorite BMWs. There you go. Interesting BMW. One of us happens to be sitting

in a BMW that he's just bought that I think he's instantly fallen in love with. We love people

that have instant love affairs with cars. Write that down Finley. Instant love affairs with

cars. There's a topic. Yes. Yes. Another t-shirt. Another t-shirt. Let's begin with these changes

that have been announced. Some might call it backtracking from the EU. Not that any of this

has been remotely predicted by this podcast at all that these 2035 regulations might represent

some of the poorest central making ever seen by a political body. But I'm going to go straight

to Chris Cooper, who as ever will explain these in a nonpartisan logical way. Well, this was Neil's

suggestion as a question because it was a good spot over the weekend when he saw the latest part of

this news. Last week it was trailed that there was a suggestion the EU would allow combustion

engine cars to be made beyond 2035, which was previously the cutoff, still formally the

cutoff. But only if they use synthetic or e-fuels or whatever it is, blah, blah, blah.

That was followed a few days later by this rumor that actually the EU may just push the whole

thing back to 2040. It isn't going to happen. I mean the death of the combustion engine

isn't going to happen. The 2035 thing with synthetic fuels I think is interesting because

at one level you might say, aha, there's an incentive now to invest in all of these

e-fuels and synthetic fuels and some very clever people trying to do that. But the darker side of

me thinks, do you know what? That's the thin end of the wedge. Would I invest my money in an

e-fuel when I could get closer to 2035? And suddenly on a whim, the regulators could say,

we're going to carry on with gasoline and diesel cars. Your synthetic fuel world suddenly

becomes a whole lot less interesting and valuable. So we've talked about this a lot.

We've wondered whether we get pushed back. There is a split in the manufacturer lobby.

People like Volvo and I presume Polestar who have full, full facts committed to EV futures

are probably thinking, hang on a minute. We took you at your word, people of the EU,

and now it looks like you're equivocating. I suspect they're doing more than equivocating.

Whereas BMW, Mercedes, other bigger manufacturers with a broader industrial base

and a greater investment and commitment to internal combustion engine might say,

few. My bet right now, a small bet, a gentlemen's sporting bet would be the closer

we get to 2035 or 2040, the more fudges and caveats there will be. And internal combustion

engines in one way or another will still be available. Maybe just smaller numbers of specialist cars.

Who knows? It's such a moving feast. But I think the UK's position right now,

it remains formally the case that 2030 is the cut off, looks increasingly untenable.

Is my summary. I think that's the first summary. Neil, you spotted this. Well, I have to say,

I spot, I saw it at the same time. I think all of our Instagram algorithms are spotted around

the same area. What do you think, Neil? Well, it's our daily search for emergencies.

As we're now looking to do at least two emergencies a week. But this actually is probably the biggest

one. We probably were a bit premature in our last emergency because it should have been this

emergency. Because this is the biggest one probably that we've had, isn't it? This is

bigger than, I don't know, will Max win the blah, blah, blah. Look, I think it's good news,

isn't it? Hopefully it's practical news. It looks, it's not been officially, officially

officially said, is it? And it's a lot of lobbying coming from, I don't know whether it was

the Mercedes guy or the BMW guy, but he's basically telling the FT by the looks of it,

what the EU have already decided, even though the EU have not actually said anything.

So that's immense pressure going on through industries that probably are going to get possibly

wiped out or under immense pressure and German unemployment going through the roof if these

things aren't changed. It looks as though it totally is going to change. Hopefully we would all agree

in our little world of motoring that it's logical and practical, that it does get pushed back

a bit because who knows? Maybe they'll be able to create cars and fuel that is so efficient that we

don't need to just make electric cars. It says the man that's 14 years late on electric cars that's

actually sat in one, but it does, it does have a little range extender in the back.

It's a car that I fell in love with quite quickly. I presume you have as well.

Well, I haven't bought it. I've been lent it by a lovely company called Wisely that are the experts

in BMW i3s. No promotion there, but it is the, I think it's the thinking man's i3 because it's

the range extender, but with car play, but not the S. So it's, you know, I'm told obviously

it's the one to have Mr Clifford and it's not for sale, but if you want to buy it,

then we'll have a chat. It's one of those loans, but it's really good. It's really,

and actually I thought I had one and then I said to my wife, did I have one or was it a dream?

And she said, we did have one for a week and you're an idiot because you got so annoyed

with the bloke because you couldn't get the price you wanted. You gave it back and I really

wish you'd have kept it nine years ago. So now I'm the last man ever to say that the i3

is brilliant. And obviously now, as I've probably semi-owned one, it is brilliant. I just think that

hopefully this will get formalized and a bit of pressure. There is a bit of pressure on the

UK now to maybe come in line with that because it's going to be very difficult not to come in

line with it, isn't it? I've just been handed a piece of paper that's up there. It's wonderful.

Lovely Indian chap who helped me with the internet a minute ago just says

heads up there's a stewards meeting for the rally scheduled in this room in another

20 minutes. That's good for me, isn't it? So I'll be homeless.

I'll bring them all in and introduce them. And then when they're discussing the

hopefully we might get some time back because we pressed our overtake button,

I think 52 times on the last stage and didn't get that pass. Right, I think it's fascinating

because this podcast is completely apolitical. But there is, let's just say, if your politics

leans to the left, you're probably not that into the motor car. But if you look at the bigger picture

here, it's the sort of state ownership of a particular car company that is probably helping

force this in Germany. Lower Saxony owns a chunk of the VW Group. And ultimately,

if this doesn't work and they can't and Volkswagen Group starts to suffer,

there will be mass unemployment in that area. So that they really need to be able to build

ICEs. It's a bizarre situation that you have a state ownership of something that means

they kind of have to go to bat for stuff they don't quite believe in. I think it's very strange,

manage. I thought this felt a bit like a yes minister sketch where you kind of had Bernard

running into Humphrey again. You won't believe it, you won't believe it. Boris Johnson's

announced 2030 to get rid of the ICE calm down Bernard. It won't happen. But it will,

but it will. And then, you know, a few beats later, Rishi Sunax pushed it back to 2035. You're

quite right. He is a shopkeeper's son. He's not a shopkeeper's son. He's a pharmacist's son

and a GP's son. Well, that's not a great medical profession. But he went to Winchester.

Well, that's not a very great school. You can see that. And then Keir Starmer's brought

it back to 2030. What are we going to do? We're going to announce an inquiry and it's

going to be in 2027, which is what we're doing. We're having an inquiry in 2027,

and Bernard is going to make sure, along with Humphrey, that that inquiry is going to take about

five years to report. And we're going to fall into line. Of course it will. Of course it will.

Of course it will. But we'll fall into line with the EU, which we've left. But we will

fall into line. And we will also announce it's 2040, because that's what we do. It's

kind of genius. I mean, the great shame is that R1, real last volume car company, JLR,

that operates in the UK, would really benefit from this more than anyone else, wouldn't they?

So we really need this. Do you think via the medium of this podcast, we could reach out to

the lovely people of Jaguar Land Rover and say to them, look, you know, you know,

we have a love affair with what you're trying to do. We do, because all that we've said has always

come from a place of love and passion. It would be great to go and meet them and talk to them

about what they're trying to do and see them. And so they can inform us that we can talk with

more passion about that. I think that would be. I think that might already be being organised.

So I'm really happy about it. Okay. So actually. So I go on. I just say it's quite rare

in this day and age to have a really good news story that features the internal combustion engine.

And this is, you know, I think this is a good news story. And I'm not just coming at this as some sort

of knuckle-dragging petrolhead who wants to eschew any kind of new technology. I think it's just

it's common sense meeting the enthusiast in a place where no one needs to feel guilty is what

is what I think personally about this. Go on, Chris Cooper. May I just one last point and

I'd be interested to see how our esteemed correspondents and audience feel about this and

their views on it from around the world that there is a dimension of moral hazard here

in that well-worn phrase from the global financial crisis 15, 17 years ago and every

once that some institutions were quote too big to fail. Volkswagen is too big to fail

because the economic and social and human consequences of that would be enormous.

The moral hazard is that by is there is a temptation for the manufacturer not to do

quote the right thing which is accelerate the investment and move towards electric vehicles

because they know that if they don't there is a possibility that the regulator will rescue

them in some way in this case by moving the date or fudging and all those and that is a

wider social debate for society to have I think our view would be I think Niels put his

his finger on it a little earlier if the regulator was to say we want to target outcomes rather than

mechanisms so the outcome is you want to lure emissions rather than stop you building certain

kinds of technology does that incentivize a manufacturer to say right turns out we've

got some quite clever people who look at this stuff all the time let's let them loose on

this problem of the outcome and I think that would get us all to a place where we can recognize

that there is a global challenge on emissions the population well is getting ever bigger

that in itself we have to respond to can't pretend it isn't happening so but I think

the fact that common sense is everything's debate is good and I think from our point of view

loving the car and motoring and all the ventures that we have

um this feels like a positive set forward we welcome it

yeah um let's move on to an even more serious subject wait one second what time is your meeting

is it in 10 minutes I'll be out and I'll be out in nine um so I will I'm um I'm moving on to

Chris yes Stuart's meeting starting in a minute I'll probably get thrown out for this um Christmas

movies best car movie intro at least we'll be dealing with a really adult subject when they

walk in and realize that this world worth having me here um Christmas movies best car movie intro

that's interesting what's the question is is it the best car movie Christmas movie or is it

the best car movie intro Neil I look at this as in what's the best car movie you can watch at

Christmas to cheer yourself up because it's Christmas and therefore of those car movies which

one's got the best intro so it doesn't need to be a Christmas movie with a car in it

it's a car movie you watch at Christmas that's certainly the way I've looked at it

the car bit has to be at the beginning of the film yes hence the word intro yeah do keep up

and it seems it seems it seems a rather mean spirited way to apply the um the logic

it is the time of year to be mean spirited isn't it okay well you can bloody well start

go I'm scratching my head here go on okay well I'll talk slowly the the my favorite car movie

with a good intro is the obvious one which is obviously a shit movie apart from the intro

which is Le Mans with Steve McQueen because the beginning of that movie I've tried to

reenact it so many times with my friends with the slate grade 2.2 s screaming through those

beautiful uh desolate isolated french country roads that are straight as an arrow with all the trees

and then he goes into the little village which we're convinced is our nage

and drives past all the little shops because they're all closed because everyone's asleep

because it's two o'clock in the afternoon and then the he parks in that car park which

have parked in many times overlooking the cathedral in the old town of Le Mans

which now you know is particularly when you go to Le Mans is full up but I think in the movie

there's like four cars two citrons and a reno and he just parks up and I think oh you know it's

that funny 2.2 s with the american front lights which at the time you're like oh why why has he

got those funny those funny lights in the front but now you look at it and think actually it's

really cool what's got those front lights what feature is some move what feature is

particular to a 2.2 s that wasn't on a 2.4 s the oil filler cap yeah yes the oil clapper

yeah yeah it's well it's only on 1970 I think um and and it's in slate gray and it's got the

perpita half leather and it's got his sunroof and it's all going on and that's my that's 100%

my favorite start to that move the rest of the movie is actually a bit shit apart from

it's quite good to look at Steve McQueen because he's lovely but that's the best bit

right gotta work out where to go there hold on that's the pool there

carry on to find starlink right keep going keep going

it really is

manage why don't you go there I'll sit here for a minute okay well I uh

I think there are two films that um I I dip into actually more than once a year

and uh one's a thriller and the other one is I think a definite car movie I think the

Italian job for me has just got the greatest intro with the car ever you know I'm obsessed with

Murat so that's that ticked it's really interesting isn't it that they didn't do something more

obvious and go with the Ferrari and that always makes me makes me think about how lateral in

some ways that movie is so we've got Norwich Murat the Italian countryside but if you actually

watch it it's what's his name Bratsio's forget his first names that were so named Bratsio the

guy who's driving the car who comes up with a master plan I love watching him drive and you're

hearing that that beautiful piece of music Quincy Jones on days like these and um you're watching

him he there's a really lot of subtle change in it starts sort of almost in the summer

and then when he gets up into the mountains suddenly you start to see the snow and he

puts those really cool designer sunglasses on lights a cigarette who's got this thing

just literally hanging from the cover it it's just the epitome of calling you wonder where is

this going I was watching because where is this going and then bang they blow him up and then you

have that line of lunches don't you fiat fiat and um I forgot the name of the baddie and he

sits and he crushes the sunglasses under his shoes and that's it you know what this story is about

before the story ever opens and that for me is it's it's the best kind of storytelling

we've all we've all re-enacted that I'm sure or certainly up the cold of terrini or one of the

past we've all done it a million times is that an intro I don't I don't I'm still slightly confused

that's not the intro because a whole load of film before that no no it begins with the wine

of the v12 and you see it does you see what you think is about the camera hands down you see

Chris Cooper well I've got two answers to this question um because there is only one Christmas

movie there is only one Christmas movie and it's so much a Christmas movie you can only

watch it on Christmas specifically Christmas Eve ha ha ha now I have a machine gun it's die hard

it's the best Christmas movie welcome to the party pal it's and and I if we had all the day

I could recite the whole bloody script it's wonderful so it's a fantastic Christmas movie

we watch it at home for every year for the last seven or eight years we sit down in Christmas Eve

I take a little photograph of the opening scene as the jumbo is landing in Los Angeles and send

it to Mr Harris because that's my Christmas card to him every year um it is that the intro is a jumbo

yes because I said there were two answers one is what's the best Christmas movie and the second

one which I'm just about to get to is what is the best car movie what is the best movie with

the car intro which makes you happy at Christmas and I had Italian job as one but I think actually

a really funky fun one is Bell Bottoms baby driver no that's good Ansel egg egg or Elgort in a 2006

uh wrc super wrc with sti enhancements with John Bernal Eliza Gonzalez and John Hamm

I've watched this movie a few times and when John Bernal just points forward he sticks it in

reverse and does the most amazing fantastic it's just brilliant everyone will see in it but that

is a great movie to watch at Christmas with a great opening titles car scene makes you happy

those are my twists fly me this is I'm on the spot here so it's just potentially two answers

I mean Christmas movie I think I'm with Chris I just love die hard it is a Christmas film and um

but just think it's just a it's a brilliant brilliant um film so I'll go with that I mean

I tend to dip back into Bond films over Christmas I'm always I think I think they're not Christmas

films but for those of us that are old enough to remember that you had you bought the

radio times and the and the tv times and your dad bought them and put them on the table and went

you know circle around what you want you can all argue about who can watch it on the telepods

you're the youngest you get outranked but but the bond film was the one thing everyone agreed on

everyone wanted to watch whatever bond film was on even though right even if it was never say

never again you'd all sit down and watch it and and talk about how the franchise speared off into

parallels um well shorn too old um and you know you know I could even watch you only live twice and

I find that purgatory so um I think and this is controversial that some of I think one of the

best sequences of stunt driving in a bomb film was at the very beginning of quantum of solace

when the dps is in the tunnel and it ended up going it ends up going backwards

I'm pretty sure that was choreographed by my friend Ben Collins and he did the driving for

the tunnel scene I think the dirt driving was done actually by um by Higgins um and

by Mark Higgins and David his brother is actually co-driving on this event here and being hugely

helpful to me because I'm useless at go one I've only just started my god have I got a

baptism of fire here so I'm going to go I think there's something about the driving in that

film it was just before it all got a bit too silly and drifty the cars actually looked like

they were in a chase and they looked like the person that was trying to get away was trying

to save their own life that's another that's maybe another subject maybe Finley can remember that

one when when does driving in a film really look like the driver is trying to get away from

something it's not just choreographed to look cool it's like that car's got the language of

if I don't if I don't win this one I'm dead and I think that is a very different look to

talking and quantum of solace I think has got some of that about it when the when the alfa

from a priest cast chase of down into the quarry it's quite it's quite edgy actually um in fact

quantum of solace is a film I really disliked at the start but has got far more going for it

than people give it credit for I think it's a great bond film I had 100% with you either

on my list as well but I'm glad I left it to you because I 100% agree all of those

Daniel all of those Daniel Craig they all merge into one for me I can't tell the

difference between any of them they're all great but I can't I could no

no I wish I could right let's go let's go for the lovely warm feeling of a four by four when it's

windy and wet or in a storm when only a four by four will do comma basically you know what

I just I'm not there but I've heard it's a bit rough in the UK at the moment and it sounds

like they are quite handy things this week let's go to Manish who certainly doesn't

nor ever has done or ever will drive a four by four well I have driven one I just never

owned one but um the the line that that caught my eye in this was it's windy and wet

or in a storm and um I have to tell you um I have a very very good friend in Abu Dhabi

who had a 2008 so pre- facelift L322 and it was black wonderful leather interior I mean really

beautifully specced and he's a bit of an artist and on the side of his car there was an Emirati

insignia from the Air Force with a little red wedge in it and I have to tell you if you are

caught in a sandstorm it is just as nasty as being caught in a hail storm it I mean it's

unpleasant your you know your glasses don't stop anything shut your eyes shut you know shut

your eyes get into one of those and drive down through the desert on a highway just watch the

sand drifting across blasting against you there is nothing as warm and secure and wonderful as

being in a supercharged L322 driving through the desert in a desert storm it's the most amazing

feeling you're high up you feel kind of bulletproof those things are they're either they were

pretty wonderful cars pretty peak do you like the post facelift ones perhaps you guys when was that

12 wasn't it but I don't know about that from 08 to about 10 they were they were mid yeah that's

just the most beautiful era wasn't it L322 in a sandstorm you're safe it's all bulletproof

it's all beautiful and that little insignia proving you're an artist on the side god I love that car

I think you're right about that the sandstorm sorry the sandstorm thing I think sorry

Neil you go on my apologies no go ahead Mr Cooper no go ahead I was saying I remember reading

Biggles books when I was growing up and they told you all about sandstorms when

Biggles goes east or Biggles goes sandy or whatever they were called or Biggles to the rescue and

and there'd be sandstorms and you're absolutely it's it's your description of it managed

reminded me of reading those Biggles books all those years ago very evocative sorry Neil back to you

no I I think the four by four gets a bad rap really I think I think I think we're over

negative about it and we clearly are well I'm not wrong because I'm not negative about it but

I think you can't argue with success of a genre or a type of car it's it's a it's a it's it changed

automotive to a large degree didn't it and I think it's there's many many many reasons why

consumers love the four by four thing and my particular I think we've got some sort of

named storm at the minute haven't we boomer or sumer or some bloody thing I don't I don't get this

naming storms things all a bit of an exaggeration isn't it like we it rained a bit basically and

there's a little bit windy last night I mean it's hardly a bloody tornado or a hurricane

but when you when you when you get in it's particularly when it's dark and it is raining

or it's windy or just basically winter I think it's a lovely protective feeling jumping into

the Range Rover or the you know whatever the slam of the door the fact that you're higher

you feel safer than you you you feel you feel that you can escape anything if it's gonna flood

it's a bit like that sort of overengineered thing that we talked about recently with

having a watch that goes down to 65 000 meters you can go in a swimming pool on your holiday

I think the fact that it's you can survive what could well be one percent chance of disaster

I think is a lovely feeling you put on the heated steering wheel you put on the heated seat

you set it at 23 you know you're going to be safe and I think it's a I don't think any car

does that as well as a four by four you may well be driving to work or you know you're probably not

going to go up a mountain in Anglesey you know but I think it's a the cosy protective

feeling of that four by four I think is one of the big reasons why they are successful

and I like that feeling yeah I good god there's so much in there I want to reply to

my Chris Cooper go first so I think that's a love letter to the four by four

I 100% agree with it I had one question though Neil does it matter what kind of tires you're on

good right answer no no that doesn't matter they're all round and black and sticky

excellent um I'm gonna be right he's gonna carry on Chris or not are you gonna move

is that what are you finished no no I carry on one one small thing to add which is

this is about the best four by four by far Land Rover and Land Rover I stand to be corrected here

I'm sure there's an example that the challenge is this but Land Rover is always stood apart

we're biased we're talking about this from within the United Kingdom so it's the home team

but it's been the manufacturer that only does one thing it makes four by fours it's pushed

what a four by four can be granted but its DNA is a four by four Toyota makes arguably one of the

most impressive if not the most impressive and robust and reliable four by four the Land Cruiser

but Georgia does other things as well gave us the LFA for example that's not a bad thing

but this is about a love letter to the four by four and I was in a Land Rover product

earlier on this week in the Little Storm and Neil's right you know I got in and it's sort of

you just look at the little thing on dashboard and says do you want to raise the wading height

to nine to 900 millimeters and I thought because on our little lane where we live the farm

there were some quite big puddles I mean you could feel the underside of the car not

just the tires sloshing in the water so I thought I'm just going to press the wading depth up a bit

I mean I was nowhere near needing to do it it just felt safe and comfortable it's lovely and warm and

lovely lovely is the word okay so yeah Neil said something that I I normally agree with

lots things Neil said but I profoundly disagree with one thing you said it doesn't mean I'm

right I just I've always felt as a journalist that it's actually that it's the one statement that I

react to I don't think you I don't think if something's popular it's right but I think you

know the idea that the four by four is popular doesn't make it right and I don't need to name

certain things in history that have proved very popular that when we look at them in hindsight

weren't very good but you know lots of things you mean come on and I think you know the

escort mark the escort mark four was incredibly popular but it's an absolutely awful vehicle

and I think the four by four yeah okay I think if you could tell me that the four by four was popular

because it felt costating and safe in stormy weather I'd agree with you but actually it's just

so mummies look cool on the way to school it's nothing to do with what they can actually do

so no I don't agree with you well but they're not but but surely you have to

acknowledge the fact that they're not using any of the things you're talking about

what what what makes them popular is their image it's not because they can do the things they do

because they never do any of those bloody things they spend most of their time in town

driving between large houses and schools I mean that's how many of them are actually out there

it's the feeling that you can if you need it it's it's safe

but because of because of that we're using twice as much fuel we're using twice as much

tyres that we fucking need to the four the SUV has accelerated the death of the motor of the

i-c e motor car we love because politically it's so easy to latch on on how horrifically

inefficient it is it's it's awful you know it's it's done it's not explaining the negative so

I was explaining why it was popular but I but I think I I actually completely agree with what

you're saying I just I just I don't think it's a positive thing for a message at all

but but I but I do think the late Alan Clark described it beautifully now he used to write

with real passion about a series one first generation Defender diesel and it had a diesel

engine made in the UK which was actually very advanced at the time it was one of the first

direct injection diesel engines that used a high-pressure pump and he used to write about

driving it to his estate in Scotland and he used to write about driving it in his

disco disco disco yeah sorry disco yeah um yeah my head's a bit fun and um and he used I remember

one phrase when he stuck with me and he to describe the high driving position of driving

in inclement weather which and the high driving position if you drive in poor weather is so

so much safer it's raining because you're above the spray for most vehicles and he said

I don't want to be staring at the axle casings of hgvs and he uses the phrase

axle casings and he's so right yeah you know if you find yourself in a lotus exige in a

rainstorm when you're behind a lorry you do feel incredibly vulnerable and and where I

would count I'll contradict what I just said is that human beings are incredibly defensive

creatures you know we might be we might think we're quite advanced but ultimately if you've

got some children you're just going to put them in what you think is the biggest

safest box possible and you don't really give a shit if the chance with the checker

is going to tax you you don't really give a shit if people are going to sneer at you

you just want to be in the biggest box possible and it's got landrover badge on it it looks lovely

you're going to do it because you're ultimately homo sapiens and you're there to protect your

clutch and that bit I get I don't like it I'd rather be in an rs6 with a bit of spray thanks

but um but I think it's a it's a really interesting one it's a really interesting one and I'm

not being deliberately opposite I just think it's a shame that but the there's no vehicle

whose capabilities are so underused as these things when you go and see the way they're

developed you go and watch go and see a landrover been developed I've been lucky enough to do that

over the years when you do the journalist story and they're wading up to their fucking nipples and

it's waterproof and it's got all these buttons or do stuff and you think that's just going to

drive through full of this is just ridiculous but but that's the way that's exactly this

it's exactly the watch analogy Neil used people love knowing it can do it

and who am I I can't I can't I can disagree but I can't say that people shouldn't do it

Chris don't you think I mean the thing it's it's the I think that's the kind of unconscious

marketing though it is playing on people's sense of safety I think there's quite a lot of

marketing research on you know why do women like four by fours they all say it's the seating

position I feel safe but you've only got one child and if you hit a child in one of these

things don't you think it's worse for the child that I hit and that produces the kind of slightly

blank no I'm protecting my child it's all very primal I think the use of the four by four

to take your kids to school and that's I think how they're marketed

I think it's nicer in in in in bad weather as Chris says it's a nicer thing to draw

everybody had one Neil if everybody was exactly at the same height in four by fours that kind

of neutralizes that a bit doesn't that well or the alternative yes if you're driving a four by four

don't drive into people in a straight line I don't I find them really uncomfortable sitting in the back

when you when they yaw and they roll and I don't like being in them at all but um you're right in

a rainstorm if you want if you want to feel like you're in twister chasing a hurricane

you don't want to do it in a three series you want to be in a very great big tank don't

you of course you do you want to be a g-wagon right the apocalypse car here we go name your

favorite private detective car I mean if anyone chooses anything other than the obvious one then

you're all cretins I'm going to go with manage first well I'm not going to go with the rockford

files I'm afraid oh not going to go I'm not um I'm actually going to go I I went through this

I thought do you remember the show Vegas with Dan Tanner who had the red and he parked it

in a garage in his actual house he was always in the background and said that was just cool

Chinatown Jake Giddiss has the 48 convertible gorgeous looking thing um moonlighting BMW 635

CSI that was a great program but no I have the winner I believe the winner is

Farron Fawcett majors in Charlie's Angels who had the 1976 cobra two she made that car famous

white with the black stripe along the side that said cobra two a brilliant incognito car

to follow baddies in they will never spot you in that thing right behind that is the car for me

you've done that really well manage yeah how manage you've taken them all off the board there Neil

sorry I mean Charlie's Angels what a program that kept you going didn't it if you didn't

have the cat if you didn't have the catalogs yeah um I think we all know what you're saying

um I've I've you know I it's brilliant isn't it what where are the tv detectives nowadays

it was it was youtube youtube has killed them but

no they're all driving around in four by fours I I think um okay I'm going I'm going British

niche I there's many american ones I'd love and I love Jim Rockford bloody hell but do you

remember Hazel yes now Hazel wasn't actually that successful I don't think it was a sort of

successful prior to Minder in a way but it was really 70s I mean loads of flares loads of

hairspray I had a lot of hair jealousy because I can't remember his first name but his hair was

amazing he drove a triumph stack and to a to a 10 year old boy which you didn't really know

how shit the triumph stag was at the time but what a what a very handsome aggressive

manly car that was I think it was green actually he had made green great again before it was even

great for first time and he he was he always was pulling the birds he was always you know he

getting into scrapes but then he jumped in that target topped triumph stag in green and I thought

oh how how do you get a life like that when you you know when you you've got eczema in your

imports with a 10 years old I wanted to find a way to be Hazel yeah Nicholas was green that was

the actor oh yeah it's a great looking car the triumph stag I tell you what I think

Chris Cooper well Mr. House and we'll leave the obvious one to you but it's not

Rockford Files I think we all had another one in my mind but the private detective is a live

and kicking on TV down Cemetery Road which is on one of the streaming channels right now

Zoe Bowam the character played by Emma Thompson and it's done really well because the Citroen DS

which is such a great cool car really suits a character it's in the books as well it doesn't

really have a big part in it it's just there it's it's a car rather than a statement but it's

such a cool car and my wife and I were watching it I think the last one's out this week actually

we've caught in this week beginning whatever it's 8th of December and I had to stop and pause it

so I could go away and look it up and I thought that's the sign of a great car in a private

detective television program so I would go for the one that's right now out there

Zoe Bowam's Citroen DS good for you this this is a tricky one because obviously the

word private rather narrows it down because it can't be they can't be employed by the state

police it's not any detective's got to be driving around in Morse is Mark 2 Jag which is just my

favorite television car of all time it's the obvious one isn't it it's bloody magnum in that 308

because I just exactly I just think that opening sequence when it when he when he wheel spins

on the dirt off the side of the road bit of luck psych and also it's another it's a very important

one this we've discussed this and Neil Clifford and I do agree on this is that I used to think the

328 was better looking than the 308 it's not the 308 is better looking isn't it the 308 is a better

looking car it is much better looking car cheers now yeah I probably said this I said this before

but I didn't talk about this before there is there is a magnum there's a there's a club of magnums

in in in California we're post a picture where all these men dress up as magnum and drive around

in 308 with the shorts with the shirts and I'll I'll I saw them at car week it's just brilliant

do they have mustaches do they all yeah yep yep yep I'll post a picture of it it's great

I mean the one what did columb what did what did colombo drive

a common gear no yes it wasn't a common gear I think wasn't it no it's 300 was he

was 190 with the convertible you're right it's a Peugeot it's a Peugeot oh we had just

before didn't we I've got common gear stuck in my head yeah you're right Peugeot I love colombo

yeah um okay let's talk about formula one let's talk about formula one manage was there on the

ground at Abu Dhabi so tell us what happened oh my days I have never had such a tense few days

ever I think it was funny we got to the circuit on on Friday and there was just this sense

that that max might do it and it it's he's been building and building and building but at the

same time um I was there in 2010 when uh Fernando was meant to do it and I remember that what stopped

Fernando beating the Red Bulls was the fact that it was Fernando all on his own and it was two

Red Bulls and they could split their strategy and he had to he had to mark one of them or the other

so just from a purely motoring point of view you had this sort of what am I clown going to do that

there were so many rumors well max is going to back them up as he did in 2000 and as Lewis did

sorry in 2016 at Abu Dhabi and that was like well the circuit's different now and the cars are

so different in any way if he does that Oscar might take him up it was there was so much

speculation and the atmosphere was so tense and I have to say the turnout which can be a

little bit variable I mean the main grand sound which is opposite where we were watching was

completely full and um I would say that normally there's a lot of sort of Ferrari red I would say

overall there was this real desire that McLaren win and if the desire was that McLaren win then

Lando was obviously going to be the more likely of the two and you know I watched the quali

I know it was just incredibly exciting and just again max just just pulled it out of his hat

it was it was a fantastic but I think as fast as two laps would have done it so it was just

you know it was just that good that was I what I was doing is we have this amazing balcony that you

could in theory watch from but the problem is the screen was too far away so this balcony was at the

end of the pit straight on the right hand side if you're watching as a as a driver and but the

timing screens were about 40 yards to my left and across I just couldn't see the times so I

actually went back inside the um the paddock club just stood underneath two screens when the

cars came down I looked and again just afterwards we wandered down into the paddock it it was absolutely

electric I think in terms of if you want to show to have max on pole Lando right behind him and Oscar

right behind him you know it was just then people were like what do you think is going to

happen what do you think is going to happen of course all the sensible people were saying

well Lando is going to drive sensibly to third but that's all very sensible the

fact is in formula one you know anything can happen you have a puncture you go over a piece of

this you go wide heaven knows what can happen and then um on race day I went down I sat with

Andrea Stella's family I know them really well Andrew was obviously very very busy

and uh Edo Fede and um Michaela and I were just sitting and having a chat they were incredibly

calm and I said so how's Andrew doing it's like you know everything's been very methodical this

just has to be a normal weekend and we have to enjoy it we have to remember how lucky we are we're all

here in Abu Dhabi in the sun having this fantastic time and then very sweet Lando's father and his

girlfriend um sat on the table next to us we were having a little bit well you know he said hello

obviously they wanted to be on their own the number of people who kept coming up to him

going are you feeling nervous are you feeling that it's everything I was thinking to one other

person touch that I think I might punch them so eventually um wandered up into um went back into

the lounge and I really held my breath I did stand on the balcony for the first five laps

because the the big worry was that you know there would be some all four first turn thing

and literally just watch just watched Oscar steaming up and I saw that Oscar was on the hearts

and Lando was on the medium so we knew Lando's almost certainly going to two stop and it felt

like Oscar it was I mean it was a bit of a genius strategy because if Oscar could get past Lando

he could push Max and just keep pushing and pushing and pushing because Max knows full well

that Oscar's going to drive off after him and I think the strategy was inspired

but we all expected Lando to be covering George Russell and George made a pretty mediocre start

and then after that looked like the Mercedes just wasn't working Charlotte Clerk looks so dangerous

first five laps he was never more than six tenths behind Lando and I was half expecting him to throw

on down the inside because they'd interviewed him before the race and said you know what are

you doing he said I'm going for a podium and what about Lando he's like what about Lando

and that's absolutely not what you want to hear when you're driving for third but then

in the first pit stop I actually missed Charles coming in so I thought what's happened here

what's happened here why'd they put Lando in so early then I realized he was covering Charles

he came out and just as the race evolved it became more and more clear how brilliant

the Clarence execution was they weren't going to try to chase some kind of random glory

despite that one brilliant line from Oscar when he came out of the pit saying he said

tell me what I have to do to win this race but actually they drove beautifully as a team the

orders were executed beautifully as a team and I felt pretty emotional at the end but

the emotions really came out we went we went stood underneath the podium we saw a British

world champion you know spraying something it was I can't describe how that how that felt you

know it was just it was McLaren they did it I made a TV show in 2017 which was McLaren's

Anna's Horriblest the Honda engine didn't physically fit onto the back of the chassis

think about that eight years after that they've won both championships in their own style

and then you know the walk through the garage the walk into the paddock and then

just standing and sitting sometimes just as the McLaren personnel came in there was no

acrimony there wasn't there was no sort of hard cheese at all you could see that Oscar was maybe

you know maybe but that's all it was it wasn't anymore rancorous and that Tom Stalard was

he was titanic he was just so sort of look you know we almost did it we've got to be proud

that was through the roof and then Andrea arrived and that is when I did start crying

I just literally could not stop myself we just had a really you know he had a billion things to do

but we just had a genuine hug and it was just wonderful that you know they did it their way

and I know listen I've taken the mickey out of Mr Cooper and in fact here's time and I

rather did take the mickey out of Mr Cooper because I think papaya rules rule but

it was great to see a British team find their way back it was great to see a British driver

triumph in that way in that style that Landau has you know he's not a nasty human being he's a

lovely young man he is full of self-doubt sometimes perhaps he does wear it on his sleeves but that's

who he is and that gives me a lot of joy because I think when this whole motor racing thing is over

for him that young man is going to know who he is he'll be he'll be an older man and you know

my my father it was just so authentic this victory was so authentic that team is so authentic

it's a real team and it's not about spraying champagne and just going yeah we won we won

that's that's something but they are a team it's the most coherent group of people and

you know it was a joy a privilege a dream to be there it really was that's what I would say

well what a lovely weekend and privilege to be there Manish Neil what do you think

if Manish doesn't get that movie I'll be shocked

I think I think the look thank fuck McLaren in the end were lucky and they deserved it in the end

and if you're British you're really chuffed that Landau won and great job by McLaren

you know Zach what a genius the whole gang I don't know anyone I don't know anyone there

actually but I think what a great job but crikey it could have gone wrong in the end because they're

the best driver right on their case and it shouldn't have been that way really but in the end they just

got it over the line and congratulations and it's really great to have another British Formula

1 champion and well done to to Landau Chris Cooper I think it's fantastic there's a British

world champion in a British team it's a new world champion it's fantastic for British motorsport

with my motorsport UK hat on it's been fantastic it creates interest Landau is a different kind

of world champion it's the one we've had the last four years and probably the years before

that in Lewis and that's really good it's just you know it's not just one kind of person

that can do this great for genetic cars and their genetic junior series

yes which every every dad with 200 million in the bank now thinking aha I can be like Adam Norris

and put my son in the genetic junior so great for them great so Lawrence Tomlinson and all

of your crew up in Leeds well done you and yeah it was it was but it was a close run thing

two points and I think um my any other time he managed you said it all and it was everyone's

watching and they'll know how they feel and it's great for British motorsport but two quick additional

thoughts um if you were one of or either of the Ferrari dealers dealers drivers you'd be thinking

what am I going to do what's going to happen tricky

Charles has had eight wins in six years that he's been there Lewis has had his worst season

he wears we felt we all feel for him he's he's worn his emotion and his his confusion and his

and his upset on his sleeve bless him um and you just really hope that somehow

they can throw a double six over the winter with these new rules and somehow it's all better

but it feels like it's it's a double six it just doesn't feel um so I feel for both of them and and

for max I thought he conducted himself really well yeah in um you know he win or lose he was happy

I'm sure clearly he wanted to win um but to have got within two points if somebody said after

Zandvoort you'll be two points behind at the end of Abu Dhabi none of us would have said that is

remotely possible so I think well done to well done to the Red Bull team we can probably call it

the new Red Bull team the news of Helmut Marcos retirement at 82 he's probably due a bit of time

off whatever one everyone thinks about him um he's an incredible ashen at stalwart for the

sport he has picked the odd good driver or two in his time goodness me well championships between

them it's unbelievable actually I think Laurent Miquez and his team and all that's going on there

well done them for giving us a championship and manage the tension that you described so well

wonderful yeah I'm over the moon there's something there's something in the water

near where I was bought up I was bought up about 10 miles 50 or 50 miles from Froome and um yeah I

wish I had the button Norris water there's there's obviously a bit better than mine but it's remarkable

that little that little little part of the west country has produced the last two well sorry two

of the last three British world champions um I'm over the moon yeah Lando is a very interesting

gap and I think he's he wears his heart and his sleeve and he's got a vulnerability that a lot of

young people his age align with and and um and I think they they see themselves in that and that's

that's a really good thing you're right max conducted himself really well I the old max

wouldn't have been maybe as gracious I don't know I watched it in a I watched I watched the race or

the last part of the race in a in a on a big screen in a safari lodge in Kenya and the person

sitting in front of me was was Joss Verstappen and watching a father deal with that is you know you

forget the people like the Adam Norris's and the Joss Verstappen's what are they going through when

they watch their children duke it out in in front of hundreds of millions of people it's

remarkable I couldn't deal with the stress um I just think I could think but we should all think

Reg Bull for coming good at the end of the season and not letting McLaren run away with it I think

I still find some of McLaren's thinking around it utterly baffling and I think

I'd hope they'd admit that there's a certain dose of serendipity that got them this championship it

could have gone wrong and the outcome and the postmortem if a few things had changed

um at Barcelona would would be quite different right now and everyone be saying how do they throw

it away but the great thing about sport is you don't you don't live in the conditional

tense you don't live in ifs and buts and maybes you live in what has actually happened and

they've delivered a constructors and a world driver's champion who's British and um you know what this

country needs a shot in the arm and I want to say one thing this is really important and this

matters more than all of the accolades that Lando's got he's got the big pot he's a world champion

his girlfriend is utterly beautiful and he's got the world at his feet but he now joins that

rare group of human beings that will have his name used in the following context when

you're stopped for speeding who do you think you are Lando Norris and I think there's only

Nigel Mansell Sterling Ross Jensen Button and Lewis Hamilton and he's now joined that that for me

is the coolest group you could ever join who do you think you are Lando Norris I love that it's

brilliant here and Sterling didn't even win it no no um let's move on to a two car garage

which I think Chris Cooper is going to read out for me because I can't really see

I will read out now just a quick parish notice before that if I may the eagle eyed amongst you

will notice that there is some Chris Harrison cars podcasty merchandise now available if you go to

the Chris Harrison cars insta site you'll find a link to it um we're trying to sort out

international shipping um so bear with us on that um so yeah but please for your newest

endures there is something there for all of you so thank you very much um this week's two car garage

comes from Christian Ford uh who's down in Newquay so Christian we love this one so um this might be

autobiographical um you are a 37 year old man living on the outskirts of Newquay in beautiful

Cornwall Cornish born and bred going back 14 generations I'm a surveyor and a runner small

business I have two dogs excellent which come to work with me regularly I currently have

bear wisdom it's quite a long one but it's good I currently have a 2013 Volvo XC70 which is wonderful

but now time to change the Volvo is worth 6k on a trade seven and a half private retail

include that in the total cost of the garage 35 grand all in two cars one must be robust and

big enough to carry me and two dogs around call and Devin 20,000 miles a year other must which

could also be used for work but which is on his own um one also must be a fun the other one

fun weekend car days out on road trips he says this has been going through my mind for ages

all the best another podcast you are all a shining light to each Friday thank you the

best Christian Christian thank you chaps manish okay my first car is going to be because car

and classic this week is rather wonderful I found a 2004 Mercedes Benz W163 ML 55 for sale

very low mileage look at that I think you could have a bit of fun around Newquay in that beast

over 300 horses 2004 so it's not overly electronic I think you'd enjoy that

it's a great little car and then my fun weekender

is going to be this rather stunning 2000 very low mileage very low mileage

2000 Honda s 2000 look at that navy blue very low mileage it's got grey black interior it is a

stunning car that's my brace for the weekend yes like it I like it off you go um Neil Clifford

I can't show you pictures because I'm on my phone and if I show my phone then you can't see me

so the pictures will come up later by clever finley um the code in here was a couple of things

the guy's living alone with two dogs so he he doesn't seem to have a partner or children

which frankly is probably good in some respects because you can do whatever you want in life

and the dogs can't argue so he doesn't need a big car and the other the other the other

thing for me was a lot of mileage so if you if you choose the wrong four by four you're going to

it's going to cost you a tonne in petrol but more importantly it's going to probably break down

so I've gone Japanese I've gone small and Japanese and cute that can only be a chimney

and I love the little chimney and I think you know you I remember when I bought one

the man at the Suzuki dealership in in um in uh where was there near St Albans said

it was lovely to meet you Mr Clifford I will never see you again because nothing will ever

go wrong with this car so that goodbye because those switches are 40 years old there's a Suzuki

1972 are the same switches so you never ever anything go wrong with this car so thanks very

much so you buy a chimney I think they're about 25 grand they hold the money incredibly well because

they're super pretty actually as as an aside they do a little g-wagon body kit and there's

going to be a small g-wagon we should talk about that when it gets announced because wouldn't that

be great good point and then I've got I've stuck with Honda actually I've stuck with Japanese

so I've gone exactly if I think I've actually chosen the same car as Manish which are things

the first time this has ever happened um I've got S2000 I mean of course the right

answer is really Boxster but I'm becoming boring myself if I choose a Boxer everywhere

so but you know what I think we always choose this Honda 2000 and as they say in the magazines

a gear change like a rifle a rifle thing whatever it was you know rifle bolt right rifle bolt rifle

bolt gear change when you get over 6000 revs the engine really sings pretty car you want the hard top

I think mine was blue so I've gone full on Japanese um Chris Cooper which is exactly what I went for

as well

yes and I'll I'll just explain I quite Christian sounds like a very thoughtful

yes passionate professional man yes proud of his heritage proud of his work uh takes pride

in lots of things and I think he could take pride in a Honda S2000 beautiful roads of Cornwall

and Devon I think it's a great choice the fact that three of us agree Christian yeah you know weighed

in and I think I'm I almost went for a Jimny as well but I love a Land Rover down in Cornwall

and Devon on car and classic I found a 2009 twin cab Land Rover 110 got a pickup body

all you all you sort of worked up in there and the dogs uh all the dogs you can sit on the

back seat in front of you with you that's what I do question is a winner 25 000 miles a year and one

of them mate you'll have to get your own chiropractor yeah he's a robust man yeah he is therapy after

that right so um I've gone this is one of my guilty pleasures I really like b8 a4 all roads

there's one on car and classic and I think they're really good little cars those a4 all roads they

much better they're much better over much better over lumpy surfaces than you think that's only a

seven grand that one and I think right now I am I'm really into these I've scratched record

e92 m3 manual they're just fabulous cars they are I mean that's good as well

you can't it's a car from an era that you just think god we can't you can't buy stuff like manual

v8 m car that goes like stink sounds fabulous you can't buy that anymore so that's good they will

be a million pounds each yeah um now I'm just um so my music choice I'll explain it to you so

I'm I'm I'm just past the halfway point of the east african safari classic rally which is

easily the hardest thing I've ever done in the car I'm co-driving it's I don't really I'm a bit bashed up

because I just got off the stage half an hour before we started the podcast and um yeah it's

been an experience and I'm sitting next to I'm co-driving next to Ferdy Porsche so he says

Porsche on the side of the car and his great-granddad started it all so it's it's been

quite interesting and today we had some very big hits and he drove magnificently he really

pushed and in this when you sit in the car in the stage you put your cans on you take

your helmet put your cans on for the road stages because the car's so noisy and the latest steelo

has got a bluetooth thing where you can actually have a little bit of music coming out of your

headphones so you can talk to each other there's music in the background and we've we've been in

where we are now I'm ambasaili national park on the edge for the last two rounds today we're

240 kilometers of roads of gravel stages which is like two rallies in the UK in one day but

it's the same yesterday and when we came off I looked at him and I said am I allowed to

and he went he didn't quite know what I meant and then he looked up and he saw it because

Kilimanjaro is is right in front of us and it sits right it's it's massive and it's quite strange

having a mountain come out of the ground it comes out of the savannah it's not in a range

of mountains it's just a volcano that sits there with snow on the top and you're burning

your arse off driving along in a 911 so I had to put on Toto's Africa because he talks about

Kilimanjaro in it and I did do it it's utterly cheesy and we both exchanged and we exchanged a

large grin as we listened to Toto's Africa with the lyrics that make no sense at all

but what a tune and it's got the word Kilimanjaro in it as we looked at the mountain

I'm a lucky boy um manish lovely um it is starting to head towards Christmas and I'm not a huge fan

of all the crooning around Christmas but I am a huge fan of the movies that we tend to watch

then I love dipping into James Bond and I listened to from Russia with love this morning Matt Runroe

who actually sang on days like these I think it's a so wonderful song any time of year but especially

this time of year yeah wonderful tune uh nil Clifford what a what a voice he's got uh okay um I

didn't talk about this I went uh I went to see um our friend uh Jay Jamiraquai last night

his first of two gigs in the O2 uh I'm biased he's a mate but it was brilliant all my kids you

know young kids took them they said it was one of the best gigs they've ever went he's totally

back in the game voice is better than ever could dance like a 25 year old looks cool as fuck

basically and um so well done Jay you bloody absolutely hit it out the park million you don't

think you forget how many songs he's had that you know that you don't know them and when he plays them

you do know them I'm going the obvious virtual insanity he ended with that you know the whole

the whole of the O2 went crazy and it was a brilliant night Chris Cooper well that's

fantastic and I mean it must have been it must have been wonderful and really really jealous not to

be there um thinking about Ferrari and charl and louis it can only be the clash should I stay or

should I go that's a good one that's a good one I mean there are going to be a few

here the only good thing is it's all changed they've got they've got a little bit of luck here

that this everything's changing right double six yeah I'm off to go and see the chiropractor

and have my back sorted out thank you very much for tolerating the poor audio and all

the other stuff that's gone on with episode 65 I'm currently sitting there's a monkey down there

I can't get I can't you can't see him but there is a monkey just over there and it's not me

um so uh please go to my instagram or the um Chris Harrison cars instagram go and have a

good search on car and classic it's full of good good metal and plastic at the moment um and enjoy

the rest of your week and thank you very much for bearing with us I know this thing is a roaming

podcast but I wouldn't be able to have such brilliantly windswept and interesting co-hosts

if we just sat in the studio every week you have to accommodate some of these downsides to

have their frankly brilliant opinions and um and lovely lucid explanations and with that we send you

our love and we look forward to seeing you and hearing you while you're hearing us next week bye bye

la harina masa yes

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F1 2025 Season Review! New EV/ICE regulations in the EU?| The Car Podcast #65

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